Monday, March 29, 2010

Explosion at the Lubyanka Station

Dozens of people have been killed in an explosion at a Moscow metro station. There’s no word so far of Chechen terrorism as a cause, although the NYT has some speculation. And it’s worth noting that the offices of the FSB are reported to be directly above the (surprise!) Lubyanka Station.

According to the Beeb:

Deadly explosions on Moscow Metro system

At least 25 people are reported to have been killed in an explosion on the Metro system in central Moscow, with a second blast coming shortly afterwards.

The first blast happened at the city’s central Lubyanka station, reports quoting security sources said.

A second explosion happened at the Park Kultury station, Russian news agency Tass reported.

Ten people were injured in the first blast, Tass said, quoting the emergencies ministry.

The number of casualties at the second blast is not yet clear.
- - - - - - - - -
A ministry spokeswoman said that at Lubyanka 14 people were killed in the train and 11 on the platform.

“The blast hit the second carriage of a metro train that stopped at Lubyanka, at 0756 (0356 GMT),” Irina Andrianova said.

“There was no fire. Rescuers of the Moscow emergencies department and firefighters are now working at the site,” she added.

The headquarters of the Russian Federal Security Service (FSB), is located just above the station.

The second blast came about 40 minutes later, at 0838 (0438 GMT), and there “are killed and injured”, security sources said.

31 comments:

kritisk_borger said...

It’s highly likely that Chechen terrorist were involved in this cowardly act and I sincerely hope that the Russian special anti-terror forces get their hands on these animals and exterminate them.

That said, I don’t think we’ll ever be able to eradicate Islamic terrorism. How do you defend yourself against a suicide bomber? It just can’t be done.

I know from experience how unpleasant it is to be on the tube in the company of several radical Muslims with long beards and evil eyes, all dressed up in their traditional garb and big duffle bags sitting on the floor next to them. My wife actually got off the train ones because she was so worried that a particular radical looking Muslim individual was going to detonate something.

Zenster said...

kritisk_borger: How do you defend yourself against a suicide bomber?

Through routine applications of massively disproportionate retaliation to the point where Islam's continued existence is called into question.

Only then will Muslims rethink the wisdom of engaging in global jihad and begin to reconsider the eventual outcome of their continued support for global terrorism.

Islam must be paid in its own bloody coin. Muslims will accept no other tender and the butcher's bill only spirals ever higher with each day that we delay.

There can be no happy ending to the tale that Islam tells. It shall live and die by the sword of its own accord. Only fools and idiots think there is any escaping this. It has been this way all through history. Worst of all:

ISLAM WOULDN'T HAVE IT ANY OTHER WAY.

Zenster said...

I'm obliged to add that the only alternative is to immediately begin a vigorous campaign of targeted assassinations against Islam's top politicians, scholars, financiers and clerics.

This is one of the only options that has any hope of averting the looming Muslim holocaust that Islam is so Hell bent on bringing about.

linbetwin said...

There were 2 explosions, at Lubyanka and at Park Kultury, at least 37 dead, according to Russia Today.

The suicide terrorists were women.

Afonso Henriques said...

I am currently seeing the 13:00 hours Portuguese News (SIC chanell), they opened saying that there are 37 deaths and two suicide women peretrated the bombing.

They have claimed that "Islamic Caucasian Groups are to blame", and that their goal is to free Daguestan and Ingushetia. Surprisingly, Chechnya is not included...

And that's a touchy question... the independence of the North Eastern Islamic republics...

rebelliousvanilla said...

Ha, Zenster has my view on foreign policy that I stole from Yaron Brooks - if you support terrorists, you won't have schools, you won't have homes, you won't have mosques. I mean, it's a sad state of affairs, but this is how the cookie crumbles. We can be subjected to this terrorism thing or humiliating plane boarding check ups for the sake of 'social justice' and to not discriminate, but if we want to stop this, the only solution is disproportionate response to terrorist attacks and expulsing the Muslims from the West.

kristisk, it's funny but I have a similar attitude towards gypsies in my city. They can be a lot like Muslims, it's just that the chance of being robbed at knife point increases while the chance of terrorist attacks is zero.

rebelliousvanilla said...

Afonso, when I got home this was being said on the radio(that 37 people died) and I asked my father what happened and he said that terrorist attacks in Moscow and I asked him... Muslims? And he said: Yep. lol

I had the same reaction about the Fort Hood attack in a chatroom and a Muslim man said that I'm prejudiced and so on and when they said who did it, he said why did he have to be Muslim and I told him that it was just obvious. Fits the MO.

Armance said...

I hope Putin will get medieval on their a#ses.
Go, Vladimir!

Rocha said...

Now what they need to do is to kill ten times more Daguestani and Ingushetians that Russians were killed. Sad? Yes, but these people only understand strenght.

Camelot said...

If anything, this attack (and all the previous ones that Muslims have conducted in Russia) might lead to a West-European/Russian cooperation in the "Final Battles" against Islam on European grounds. It makes the population ratio a little different, to our advantage.

Zenster said...

Armance: I hope Putin will get medieval on their a#ses.
Go, Vladimir!


Your hopes are sadly misplaced.

Camelot: If anything, this attack (and all the previous ones that Muslims have conducted in Russia) might lead to a West-European/Russian cooperation in the "Final Battles" against Islam on European grounds.

As are yours.

If only through its support for Iran's nuclear weapons program, Russia continues to be a net supporter and exporter of terrorism.

Please consider reading Antero Leitzinger's article, "Roots of Islamic Terrorism: How Communists Helped Fundamentalists":

Russia's sponsorship of the Taliban and al-Qayda

… While Niyazov and Chernomyrdin had personal financial interests to support the Taliban, US Vice President Al Gore signed the infamous 1995 US-Russian weapons agreement, which exempted Russia from sanctions, although Russia would sell arms to Iran. This secret agreement violated the rules of 1992, by the US Congress. Gore's excuse was that Russia agreed upon not selling nuclear technology, and to stop all arms exports to Iran by the end of 1999. This, of course, never happened, and when the failed agreement was leaked to The New York Times in October 2000, Russia declared its intention not to keep it anyway. (Reuters 31.10. and 22.11.2000) The case illustrates how deeply Chernomyrdin was involved in businesses with Islamic extremists, and how Russia succeeded in having Bill Clinton's administration participate in shady deals against American public interests. There were also rumours of promised concessions in the pipeline projects, or in financial support to Gore's presidential campaign. Gore's loss at the November 2000 elections was a devastating surprise for Russian political establishment.

Thirdly, a KGB officer, Viktor But (Victor Bout), flew arms to the Taliban until 2001. The beginning of this business enterprise would have remained unknown, if a Russian airplane would not have been spotted at Kandahar airport. According to But's explanations, the arms shipment, originally intended to the government in Kabul, was forced to land at Kandahar by a MiG 21, on August 6th, 1995. This happened exactly at a time when the Taliban was about to be routed. Instead of a rapid disaster at this critical point, the reinforced Taliban turned to attack, and took over the town of Herat by September 5th. The Russian pilots were kept as hostages in Kandahar until next August 16th, when they miraculously escaped and were decorated by the Russian president. Soon after, in September 1996, an well-armed Taliban advanced all the way to Kabul.

"By August the [Taliban] group was broke and desperate. Yet suddenly they were rolling in cash and confidence. On Sept. 27 the Taliban marched into Kabul. Former mujahedin commanders close to the Taliban say the bonanza arrived courtesy of Osama bin Ladin... Afghan and Western sources say bin Laden's gift to Omar amounted to $3 million." (Newsweek 13.10.1997) According to Russian sources, the money, exactly three million US$, was a "ransom" paid directly by Russia. (Interfax 29.8.1996) Perhaps it did not make much of a difference, who delivered the money - and much more than worth of that in arms - to the Taliban?


Russia continues to support Islamic terrorism in its efforts to triangulate against American and gloabl security interests. Putin's ostensible role as a fighter against Muslim predators is a sham.

Andy said...

Tragic morning in Moscow. Here is some graphic video from just after the blast http://bit.ly/8YYp5l

Afonso Henriques said...

@ Rocha and Armance,

I understand your calls for violence and the dislpay of strenght by the Russians.


BUUUT... it seems that it has not been working down there in the Caucasus. What to do?

Afonso Henriques said...

Zenster, you honestly should try to see the world from Moscow.

"Russia continues to be a net supporter and exporter of terrorism."

Come on! Can't you see that by every assertion of this kind that you make about Russia, for instance, we can do about America?

Everyday across European Universities teachers (continue) to talk on how America armed Sadam and Bin Laden and are thus the bad evil enemy.

That's time we stop with all this demonisation.

"The case illustrates how deeply Chernomyrdin was involved in businesses with Islamic extremists, and how Russia succeeded in having Bill Clinton's administration participate in shady deals against American public interests."

Come on!!! So, the Russians made Americans missbehave?

This is such a non-issue!

If you want to see things properly, the rise of Islam was supported by America more than any other country.
If we except Israel, America has been the key for the success of muslims since the fall of World War II:
Helping Egypt against the European Powers; (Principal Invigoration of Muslim Power - PIMP)
Showing the finger to the European colonial powers for the beneffit of the muslims;
Allying the Saudis and the States of the Gulf;
Not moving a finger to help Iran in 1979;
Arming Bin Laden to destroy the Sovietic Super Power (PIMP);
Allowing Indonesia to destroy little Timor;
The Balkans (PIMP)
Allying Turkey (semi PIMP)
Putting Albania and Turkey into NATO (probabily PIMP)

America has been PIMPing the muslims (come on, don't laugh) much more than any other country.
You only stop PIMPing the muslims in the relation with Israel.

Ah! And Russia payed Bin Laden, not America. Specially when Bin Laden rose to his semi-divine Islamic warrior status fighting the Soviet Union in Afghanistan for the restauration of the Umah. Come on!

Andy, handy video.

Rocha said...

Afonso,

What to do? How much you want to surrender democracy and human rights?

You could put some of the blame for terrorism in the terrorist family (they should have reported him\her),
if they are immigrants the whole family deportation would be a good thing. You can restrict peoples moviment, because this is what permits terrorism to happens in these days, or you can retaliate on the ethnic group with bombims,etc.

One thing is for sure. WE DO HAVE TO TREAT THIS MORE HARSHLY. Every passing day it's easier to have weapons who could kill thousands, millions, maybe even billions. Viral diesises, Nuclear Bombs, Poisening, etc. If we do not perceive how much we are in danger it will happen like 9/11.

Afonso Henriques said...

Rocha, you say that we have to treat this more harshly, but the thing is, in this particular case with Russian, it's very difficult to get tougher.

What do you do? Erradicate the Northeastern Caucasian Populations?

Because it seems to me that this is indeed a response to harsh measures that were taken in the Caucasus.

What can the Russians do?
Are you suggestign erradicating the Chechens in Chechnya? I think I would be against that.

Rocha said...

Afonso Henriques,

I say we must do what must be done. The threat to the west by biological weapons, nuclear weapons and chemical weapons is not getting smaller.

Would you really be agaisnt it? How far? even after London, Lisboa, New York are obliterated?

I'm really tryng is to make think here, i'm not FOR it at the present moment but think about it.

My solution for the moment would still be harsh. Deportation from all non-western from the west and strict regulations on the movement of turists and people coming and going.

We AREN'T in the 60's anymore. There are hundreds of orgs that could blow a city if they get a bomb. Remember the tokio metro? How many terrorist attacks europe had in their soil from outsiders in the 70's?

Afonso Henriques said...

Rocha, of course we can think of how far are we willing to go.

But that's not the case. I think that we should think in some kind of "proportionate response". Proportionate in the sense that would serve our interests while maintaining our moral (ethical, divine, whatever) superiority.

Of course that after a given point, everything is possible. But we're still very, very far from that point.

rebelliousvanilla said...

Afonso, there's no such thing as proportional response and morality. We should be as harsh as possible in order to fulfill our interests and gain surrender. Proportional response just drags wars and solutions to take more than they should prolonging suffering. Also, if you just up the ante a bit, the other will probably too, until you will reach about the same point. Just look at the Yugoslavia affair out of which the US should have stayed out. Because they ruled out an invasion and chose only to perform air strikes, the Serbs thought they could win.

Afonso Henriques said...

So, the Russians have already tried to do the job in Checnya.

Do you want to give the next step? So, are you in favour of ethnically cleansing the North Caucasus? Or making it the site of Nuclear Tests?

What's the next measure now??

I can't see any. The Northeastern Caucasus is already hell. They have already been under all of the worst. What's now?

I wanted not to hear vague words but real aplicable measures.

Rocha said...

Afonso,

The job in Chechenia (i'm too layz to look for the name in english) is done. The region is pacified. Now, i would favor ethnic cleasing (really population transfer), or exile if they revolted again and again.

As for the measures now they are simple. Plain restriction of movement. Send these "dangerous populations" to their homelands were they can be productive and make they stay there. It would be ok to do a little tourism or business outside but nothing like leaving the area for months or years. Make sure they do not go out with anything dangerous. Just that would make the risk of anything drop very much.

Afonso Henriques said...

Okay Rocha, you answered to what should be done in your opinion.

That will not be done, however.

And I still have reservations on ethnically cleansing the Chechens in Chechnya.

I mean, I'm actually considering being in favour of independence of the Northeastern Caucasus.

Rocha said...

Afonso,

Be sure as now the russians will do what they have to do. Did they not invade Georgia? Did they not pacified Chechnya despite cries and weeping of the west? It just they don't think that now it's time to take harsher measures.

"I mean, I'm actually considering being in favour of independence of the Northeastern Caucasus."

Afonso i'm really your friend it hurts me seeng you writing such bull. Giving independence to them further encroaches Islam to Russia.
With the rising demographics Russia would be smaller and smaller.
You know what are we such weakling talking about givin independece or whatever for 32 deaths in 170 million people? In this rate Russia would have lost WWII in let me see 32 seconds.

Armance said...

Chechnya was pacified - so much that the central street in Groznyi is now called Putin Avenue. A puppet regime of Moscow - but it's the first time in my life when I think the expression "puppet regime of Moscow" has a positive meaning. Compare Groznyi to Kabul: Chechens are obliged to give their streets Russian names, Afghanistan has established Islam as official religion of the country through Constitution, under American auspices.

I don't have moral dilemmas regarding the Russian behavior. Yes, the Russians are imperialistic, particularly toward their Muslim subjects, the same way the Brits, the Spaniards, the French and the Dutch used to be imperialistic, and European imperialism was the golden age of mankind. The difference between Russia and the Unites States is that the former has still preserved the reflexes of a real empire, while the latter is a multicultural confusion.

I visited Russia two years ago, I was in Novosibirsk, Siberia. I met, saw with my own eyes and spoke to Muslim converts to Orthodox Christianity. I remember a young Tatar girl, radio journalist, who told me "I was born in a Muslim family but I chose Christianity because, you know, I felt a little bit strange, most of my friends are Christians, and I wanted to feel NORMAL, not a WEIRDO". Such is the power of the Russian church. Imagine a Muslim saying something like this in the West... In Russia, even TV stars, actors and models boast of being Orthodox Christians. There's a strong environment for Muslims to do something to feel normal.

Armance said...

Afonso,

you didn't understand the moral of the story. Any encounter with Muslims implies the dichotomy power/submission. The privilege of moral behavior should be reserved to your equals. I mean, in the Balkans, we used to be kind and benevolent: the result was 600 years under ruthless Ottoman rule. Only a few islands of peace, like the rule of Vlad Tepes - Vlad the Impaler - who invented such methods of torture, that he scared the masters of terror themselves. You should know better: do you consider La Reconquista ethnical clensing?

rebelliousvanilla said...

Ethnic cleansing is a moral solution when the alternative is genocide.

Armance, I agree with you, I don't have moral dilemmas over the Russian behaviour related this matter. The way I see it, it would be immoral for the Russian government to not take measures to do what's best for the Russian people regardless of the other peoples inside it's borders. And by this, I don't mean killing off and enslaving people.

Oh, by today's logic, Vlad the Impaler committed genocide against the Bulgarian Muslims considering that if my memory serves me right, he impaled 30,000 of them just for being Muslim. Obviously, this helped a lot when the Ottoman army reached the impaled people.

And yes, the Reconquista was ethnic cleansing.

Rocha said...

Of course A RECONQUISTA was ethnic cleansing. There were a no man land for most of the time, and even after conversion they were throw out of Spain in 1604 (on the rightful ground of faking and the conversion). The same thing happened in Byzantium after Mazinkert and when the 1204 crusade weakened the empire.

When two civilizations collide there are just three endings:

1. Population Transfer. It happened in the Balkans after the Great War and in the after the Second Balkan War.

2. Genocide. We all know what happened in WWII, Ottoman Empire, Ruanda and others.

3. Absorption. Latin America did it, It was done in Siberia and the Russian North, in Prussia, the Ottoman Empire.

You know the medicine. Choose It.

Afonso Henriques said...

"Afonso i'm really your friend it hurts me seeng you writing such bull. Giving independence to them further encroaches Islam to Russia."

No, no, no, Rocha. I mean, Russia is an empire. And it would only strenghten the Russian entity to let go a tumor that can grow and grow and grow.
By tumor I mean Islam in the Northeastern Caucasus.
I mean, what would Russia be if they had kept Azerbaijan and the Southern Central Asian Republics?
What's the point of having a region like the Caucasus in your empire? Those are the questions I'm exploring.

This attacks are just a "synthom", not the desease itself.

Armance, so we're denying the "right to exist" (or whatever you want to call it) to some extent, to the Chechen people.
Also, assimilation is better than what we have in the West, but I have many reserves on Europe to assimilate the world.

How do you compare the Reconquista to Chechnya, Armance?
I mean, yes, after a while we were able to take the War into the North of Africa but it was when the Reconquista was a reccent afair. Chechens did not invade Russia. They were invaded by Russia. One thing and another is beyond comparison.

RV,

"The way I see it, it would be immoral for the Russian government to not take measures to do what's best for the Russian people regardless of the other peoples inside it's borders."

I agree completely.
Okay, so in that same spirit, is it good for the Russian people to retain the Northeastern Caucasus in their empire?

Rocha said...

Afonso,

Chechens and other muslins DID invade Russia to catch slaves all the time. Any area close to islamic areas were prone to attack. The reaction to these attacks that created the empire. Before the turks, mongols and others muslins Russia was home to a dozen warring realms.

Even far away lands were the target ICELAND was attacked at least once.


Another thing Russia now supress islamists there now. with Russia gone all the Caucasus Cristians would be between islamics states. Is it what you want Afonso? That Caucasus cristians, the armenians and the georgians again find thenselves under islamic rule?
Or should we transfer them to Europe? Can Portugal receive 4 million armenians?

Rocha said...

Afonso,

Chechens and other muslins DID invade Russia to catch slaves all the time. Any area close to islamic areas were prone to attack. The reaction to these attacks that created the empire. Before the turks, mongols and others muslins Russia was home to a dozen warring realms.

Even far away lands were the target ICELAND was attacked at least once.


Another thing Russia now supress islamists there now. with Russia gone all the Caucasus Cristians would be between islamics states. Is it what you want Afonso? That Caucasus cristians, the armenians and the georgians again find thenselves under islamic rule?
Or should we transfer them to Europe? Can Portugal receive 4 million armenians?

Afonso Henriques said...

No, Chechens didn't invade Russia. Russia invaded Chechnya.
The Caucasus had been part of Turkey or the Ottoman Empire and of the Persian Empire.

And it was during one of the several Russo-Turkish wars that Christians and Muslims clashed in the Caucasus which led to the Russian penetration into the Caucasus and the Russian invasion and annexation of the region.

Then, Russians also fought the Persians and controlled the Northern areas of the Persian Empire.

But I don't believe that with the current demographics Russia can maintain certain regions of their Empire (Central Asia). And thus should lose some of the troublesome provinces, while regaining Belarus and part of the Ukraine. This yes, would strenghten Russia.
I want an European Russia, not an Asiatic Empire in the making.

And considering Chechnya, they always lived in their manners untill the colonists expelled them to Central Asia and then started colonising the place. But in the 90s Russians were cleansed of the place so they're not there in large numbers now.

Like Alekhsander Solzhenitsyn said, the empire sucks and Russia should start worrying with the Nation.

"Another thing Russia now supress islamists there now."

With Beslan, the theatre incident and the various recent bombings in the Moscow public transportation system, not to mention the actual hell that is the Northeastern Caucasus today, I'd say that Russia's works there is bringing the islamists to "The Mother Russia". They're not controling much.

And your assertion that the Christians in the Caucasus would be between Islamic States it's not true.
For instance, Armenia is already between Iran and Turkey and Azerbaijan and Georgia is between Azerbaijan and Turkey. Those new States would border only Russia and Azerbaijan and not Georgia or Armenia - although they would border the Ossetian / Alan lands, but they already do now and the Ossetians are in a way the Russians in the Caucasus, because they are also victims of the Islamits there.

And no, I will not recieve 40 thousand Armenians. Let them go to the Americas if needed be.