Friday, June 27, 2008

Gates of Vienna is an Impotent Cul-de-Sac

Take a gander at this delightful piece of correspondence we received yesterday.

Months ago, when we started being linked regularly by sites like The Invisible Empire of the Aryan White Christian Supremacist Front (yes, I made that one up), Dymphna and I decided to put up a prominent “We Support Israel” icon on our sidebar. It became even more prominent when the Pajamas Media ads above it vanished.

This dismayed some of our visitors who are, shall we say, less than well-disposed towards the state of Israel and Jews in general. Anti-jihad rhetoric seems to attract such people like mosquitoes, but they are appalled by our philo-Semitism, and sometimes feel the need to communicate to us the error of our ways.

It’s funny, because in certain segments of the blogosphere, some of them even ostensibly conservative, we are well-known as white supremacists, neo-Nazis, and crypto-fascists. We get about the same number of hate emails denouncing us as Nazis as we do denouncing us as Jew-lovers.

Evidently Gates of Vienna suffers from a split personality, and the left-wing hand doesn’t know what the right-wing hand is doing.

Normally, I wouldn’t include an email address with any correspondence I post, but this little gem demands it. Also, the address is almost certainly a cutout, so I don’t think posting it will have any effect.

** WARNING **

I’ll leave comments open for a while and see what happens. If Jew-haters appear — no matter how well-disguised they are — I will delete their remarks as soon as they are posted and close the thread to further comments. I’m sick of having to deal with this kind of crap, and I won’t tolerate it.

Here’s the verbatim email, exactly as received:

From: loxono <loxono@comcast.net>
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 5:09 AM
Subject: Why do you support people who hate your guts?

You are a GOY

Do you understand this?

The state you support is in fact a base of operations used to further erode Christian civilization

Muslims and Jews are both anti-Christian

Who do you think it was that has pressed for and gotten all these anti-free speech laws in America and Europe?

Wake the hell up!!

Who do you think is pushing to BLOCK Christian symbols in America and RIGHT NOW pushing to block Christian symbols on license plates in America even?

Abortion
Brown vs Board of Ed (got to have blacks and whites in schools together at all costs to evil whites)
So called Civil Rights (UnConstitutional “rights” for special protected classes)
1965 Immigration Reform Act
Feminism
Affirmative Action
NAACP (Jewish lead until 1976!!)
Socialism/Communism

all Jewish created, lead, and controlled

Who was it that assisted the Muslims in their quest to conquer Europe you morons!!!

As a group Jews have been the single most destructive force against white Christian civilization
- - - - - - - - -
and you idiots DARE to act as if they are an ally of White Christian Europe?

Even many Jews admit this and have spoken out against it!!

But you dolts embrace those that would kill you off!!??

Next you will be gushing about how wonderful Muslim diversity is and how much Europe needs to convert to Islam!!

Israel should be left alone…but Jews should leave our Christian nations ALONE!!!
Free from their interference in OUR peoples affairs GODDAMNIT!!!

You people will NEVER do anything revolutionary to stop the mass genocide that is occuring in Europe!!

You are therefore IMPOTENT, a cul-de-sac for whites to vent their frustrations but with NO ACTION!!!

Thank GOD for the Italians…they’re just DOING IT whilst the rest of you weak Europeans gush in AWE at their bravado!!!


HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
Viva Italia!!!
Viva Russia!!!
Hail the New Dawn!!!

47 comments:

DWMF said...

Dear Baron,

Nutters come in all shapes and sizes. Do not be down-hearted. For myself, I agree with your pro-Israel stance. This does not mean that I am pro militant Zionism, which is a different thing.

The historical ignorance of te person who emailed you is astounding. And his rabid rantings are truly off the scale.

It's probably an Arab student trying to shock you. Throw it in the bin.

spackle said...

"Israel should be left alone…but Jews should leave our Christian nations ALONE!!! "

Riiiight. And if this guy had his way Israel would be perfectly safe? Oy Vey!

talnik said...

Was he talking about George Sor...oh, never mind. You Jew-loving Nazis keep up the good work.

Qualis Rex said...

The person who wrote those comments is clearly disturbed (see: nut-case). The problem with websites like yours is many see it as a hate-forum where their personal hatreds are validated, rather than an informative forum to provide knowledge and networking. So, you will invariably attract people who hate almost everyone...which happens to include Muslims (so you're in luck! : ) But scratch their surface and you will find they most likely hate many (if not all) of the same things you believe in as well.

Regarding Israel, I will say that I support Israel's right to exist within it's present borders, but I absolutely do not support its current policies or regime. I say this as someone who has spent time there and experienced first-hand their indescriminate intolerance. And prior to my stay, I was probably one of the most pro-Israel people on the planet. So, all I can say here is, before you make up your opinion either way on the situation, I would highly recommend going there and discovering first-hand. And be sure to wear a cross around your neck.

Ypp said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Qualis Rex said...

One final P.S.: white supremecists don't get to say "viva Italia". White Supremecists love to claim Italy and Greece's achievements under their "Western Civilization" lists, but our populations are neither Aryan, "white" or homogenous (nor are they accepted among white supremecist groups anyway). So, yes, Viva Italia! And maledizione a casa tua!

Ashraf al-Halabi said...

If I were a man of a few words, I would say something like this:

You cannot defeat Islamofascism without Muslim support.

But I am not... so here I go.

Jihad can only be defeeated by a coalition of liberal (in the loosest sense of the word) forces who value, above all else, individual liberties. Jihad can only be countered by democracy and to do that, you need Arab and Muslim liberal democrats who can convince the masses that Jihad offers nothing to them and that the Islamists offer nothing to them.

Otherwise... you're further dividing the two worlds, something that the Jihadists are already working on.

This from a neocon middle easterner...

Ypp said...

The author of the letter correctly points that Jews are no good for White Power. However, the real question is as follows: Will the White Power save the West, or it will ruin the West? Given the fact that currently Western elites are mostly white, I tend to think that the White Power is ruinous.

Ultra said...

Israeli ultra ortodox comunity don't love christians neither Hebrew, Russian or Arab ones and they're mildly dicrimated by govermnt but still their legal and social situation is much better than in all neigbouring Arab muslim countries including Palestinian Autonomy championed by EU, left and HRWs and US "alies" like Egipt and Jordan. Israel is not perfect state but none is. As a Polish descendent of "Slavic untermenchen" I'm highly sceptical to so called "WN" and their race based agenda. Good work Baron.

Ypp said...

2 Al-Halibi

You are mistaken in one point: our main aim here is not to defeat jihad, but to defend the West.Defeating jihad may be desirable, but not necessary from our point of view. These are two different goals. And it is still unclear, whether the war against jihad helps to save the west, or vice versa, exhausts its resources without any result.

Qualis Rex said...

ULTRA, I agree with you to a certain extent. However, Christians are treated much better in neighbouring Lebanon than in Israel, obviously. Syria treats Christians well too (for the most part) as did Iraq before the invasion. (and by the way, NICE icon : )

Ashraf al-Halabi, no disrespect, but "Islamofascism" is a made-up, meaningless word and concept by the Bush administration. There is no "Islamofascism"; there is only Islam. You are either a "good" Muslim and believe in bringing about the Khalifia through jihad and the implementation of shari'a, or you are a "bad" Muslim who picks and chooses the parts of the Qur'an you find relevent or palateable to your lifestyle. Either way, it is irrelevent what Muslims or jihadis think of the west or our civilization, since it is not based on Islam or any tenets thereof. We do not need "liberal Muslims" (see: "bad" Muslims) to dictate or ally themselves with the West in order to placate some jihadists. To the contrary. You should concentrate on these jihadists yourselves. They are principly your problem, yet we have to deal with them. And I for one am tired of taking out my neighbour's trash.

Afonso Henriques said...

I really tried to avoid commenting this but reading some comments...

Qualis Rex are you mad?

"I support Israel's right to exist within it's present borders, but I absolutely do not support its current policies or regime."

I don't doubt of your expirience in the lands of Sion but the world is not perfect. We have to make dificult choices and saying what you said can only lead to the distruction of the State of Israel. I support Israel and I think that in Israel, the Jews should do whatever they want.
If you had a 9/11 every week you would make some though moves too, wouldn't you?

"White Supremecists love to claim Italy and Greece's achievements under their "Western Civilization" lists, but our populations are neither Aryan, "white" or homogenous"

So, Italians and Greek are not "Aryan, white or homogeneous"? They are not Westerners so... Interesting view...
In my opinion, nobody is more "Aryan or white", that is European, than the Romans and their descendents, the Itaians. Or we see Italia as the centre and craddle of Europe or there is no Europe.
Also, I will not adress Italian homogeniety, but Greece is pretty much homogeneous.

To the Arab guy:

Go to the desert and tell me if potatoes grow there also.
So, you want help? Where were your kind when my Nation and the rest of Europe needed help? Oh yes, rading against us for slaves and comcubines.
I will not make internacionalist "liberal" alliances with muslims that will ultimateley "liberate" them to colonise my Nation or destroy it in some other way.

We are all brothers. Races are all equal. Europeans have had hard times to make Europe what it is. Work yourself out!!!

"Otherwise... you're further dividing the two worlds"

So? I don't care about anti-jihadism. All I care is to live well with my people away from threats from the desert...

Ypp,

" Jews are no good for White (...) Given the fact that currently Western elites are mostly white, I tend to think that the White Power is ruinous."

Now I understand the American mind and its atraction to Obama. Don't vote KKK, don't vote whitey.

Damned!!!

PRCalDude said...

Every white supremacist is like this. You ask them about the jihad and Muslims and they feel an affinity towards both. They'll tell you "It's because of the kike." As far as illegal immigration is concerned, there's some cabal of Jews controlling illegal immigration and not the white robber barons who own the businesses in this country and want the cheap labor.

For them, Islam = good and Jew = bad.

Qualis Rex said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Rier said...

Ashraf al-Halibi:

I don't disagree with you and I presume you're in good faith, but finding those kinds of Muslims seems difficult, or perhaps its not so much that they are few and far between as much as a reality that, out of fear, they decline to take a firm stand.

We (Western governments and publics in general) tend to view as "moderate" any Muslims who "denounce terrorism" even though they may still believe in the Supremacy of Sharia law and other Islamist goals, but take an incremental, fabian approach to their implementation. And in the end, we simply end up being triangulated by the more insidious strategies of these groups. So I ask you, as someone who I presume may have some insight into these things, what will it take to get moderates of the kind you talk about, to stand up to, and defeat, more militant Muslims and how will they go about it.

I would love to see a group like the Muslim Canadian Congress actually engage in aggressive lawsuits against groups like the Islamic Supreme Council of Canada and CAIR, and even leading a campaign to have groups like these latter ones forcefully disbanded. But how do you overcome the violence and intimidation that groups like this would have to resist from within the Ummah, if that's what's holding them back, or in any case, to take a stand? Better yet, how will such liberal Muslims, defeat groups like al Qaeda, pull the plug on the historic Jihad and Sharia traditions and bring about the kind of transformation of Islam into something permanently and unalterably benign that will be necesary to ensure the peace of the world and why aren't they doing that now? Please lay out your vision of how this can proceed, because the kind of general comments you made above are in themselves, just like any other typical platitudes that stealth Jihadists use to confuse and bamboozle us.

Your comments above make it sound like the onus is somehow on us, but on the contrary it is on the liberal democratic Muslims you mention. Why aren't they taking up the fight? They're allowing the good name of Islam to suffer, whereas you would think that they would want to protect it agressively by fighting to redeem it. The time for them to act is now (and twenty or more years ago) and so far we hear nothing from them. Why?

Avery Bullard said...

qualis rex:Regarding Israel, I will say that I support Israel's right to exist within it's present borders, but I absolutely do not support its current policies or regime. I say this as someone who has spent time there and experienced first-hand their indescriminate intolerance.

I'm surprised you haven't been accused of being an "anti-Semitic Jew-hater" for making that comment!

prcaldude: Every white supremacist is like this. You ask them about the jihad and Muslims and they feel an affinity towards both. They'll tell you "It's because of the kike." As far as illegal immigration is concerned, there's some cabal of Jews controlling illegal immigration and not the white robber barons who own the businesses in this country and want the cheap labor.


No, they don't say there's a "cabal". Their argument is much more sophisticated than your LGF-style caricature.

Jihad can only be defeeated by a coalition of liberal (in the loosest sense of the word) forces who value, above all else, individual liberties. Jihad can only be countered by democracy and to do that, you need Arab and Muslim liberal democrats who can convince the masses that Jihad offers nothing to them and that the Islamists offer nothing to them.


As far as the West is concerned immigration control and a humble US foreign policy will defeat jihad. What happens in the countries that actually are Muslim is of little relevance to us.

Qualis Rex said...

Avery,

I've been accused of being pretty much everything in the book at this stage of my life : )

While I agree with the sentiment of your last sentence in the above comment, I would add 1 caveat: as a Christian, if there is a Muslim country with even 1 Christian, we are obliged to help them and treat them as our brother/sister. Their suffering is our suffering. So, while how Muslims treat Muslims in Muslim countries is irrelevant as you say, how they treat Christians (and other minorities, including Jews) is. In fact, I would say, that Christians (and possibly Buddhists and Bah'ais) are probably the only religious groups in the world who care about and indeed show and act upon a sense of responsibility for groups outside their own. And I firmly believe that it is from this background of ethics thatour modern Western civilization is born.

Just wanted to make that clear, as I agree with the rest of what you said).

Baron Bodissey said...

Qualis Rex --

Gates of Vienna's rules about comments require that they be civil, temperate, on-topic, and show decorum. Your comment violated the first of these rules.

Civil: No name calling, gratuitous insults, personal slurs, denigration of someone’s intelligence, etc.

I realize that Afonso can be a bit trying at times, but you will have to find another way to take him to task. I suggest rewriting your comment, leaving out the personal insults this time.

Rier said...

Baron:

I believe it is a mistake to post this kind of lunacy as a separate story. Giving it such prominence can lead to a polarization that brings out precisely the kind of Jew-bashing you fear. In such an atmosphere, even legitimate comments such as Qualis Rex's can be used as a wedge by idiots like the one who sent you that email. Does that mean that we will then simply not discuss the topic?

The fact is that people come to positions that are anti-Western, pro-Islamic, pro-Jihadist, etc. from within all sorts of identities ranging from Marxist to Capitalist to Christian, and yes, even Jewish. Consider the ultra-Orthodox Jews who condemn the state of Israel as illegitimate and who apparently consider it acceptable to live as dhimmis under Arab rule. It is now coming to light as well that the myth of the "Golden Age of al-Andalus" was generated, at least in part, by liberal Jewish historians seeking to discredit the Spanish crown. Talking about this is not anti-Semitic any more than criticizing the late Pope John Paul II for kissing the Koran is anti-Catholic. But by posting this guy's hate message your concern about Jew-bashing may become a self-fulfilling prophecy. Will you then feel compelled to censor legitimate consideration of issues involving the Jews as "too sensitive"?

I would say it's best to simply ignore messages like that and delete them when and if they appear in your blog.

Qualis Rex said...

Baron, I read you loud and clear. And my point was made. However, in my defense, when someone asks rhetorically "are you mad?" this too is an insult by implication (I parodied this twice in my response). Are these types of insults fair-game for usage on your site? If so I will remember to keep them among my armaments. If not, I would kindly request that you remove Alfonso's post as well, since that type of insult is not at all civil either.

Once again, best regards and speedy recovery to you and yours.

Baron Bodissey said...

Qualis Rex --

I can't catch everything. I try to touch the high spots and deal with the most outrageous examples.

With the number of comments we get nowadays, monitoring all this can be a full-time job.

If it's any consolation, I've deleted any number of Afonso's comments. He seems to have trouble learning the rules.

Natalie said...

Oh, don't you just love hate mail. Seriously though, it can be quite amusing to read sometimes. And then I remember that there are actually real people who think what this idiot wrote in this email, and that's kind of scary.

The whole thing's rubbish, but at least it proves, or rather continues to prove, one thing: that Gates of Vienna isn't a white supremacist, neo-Nazi hate site. Hear that, LGF?

My favourite part of the email is "Viva Russia!!!" Seriously, what's with that?

the doctor said...

Dear Baron , I had not realised that you had to put up with this sort of thing , my sincere commiserations .
Have I been lucky that I have not had to bear that idiocy on my blog ?

Spacecase said...

I guess I was naive to think that the defense of the West is really a joint Judeo-Christian venture. It seems so clear to me, that I had not imagined a forum like this would attract the likes of this Loxono fellow.
It is clear that someone who believes what he believes is merely defending the West against Islam in order to establish another equal tyranny.

Ypp said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
PRCalDude said...

No, they don't say there's a "cabal". Their argument is much more sophisticated than your LGF-style caricature.

Not really. I know several. It's easier to believe than that white Baby Boomers are responsible for most of our own problems regarding the immigration problem.

Could the Jews be pro-open borders and could they be supporters of illegal immigration? Of course. But it still requires the rest of white America to cooperate. The white-owned restaurant that employs illegal immigrants is that way because of white greed, not the Jews.

Avery Bullard said...

While I agree with the sentiment of your last sentence in the above comment, I would add 1 caveat: as a Christian, if there is a Muslim country with even 1 Christian, we are obliged to help them and treat them as our brother/sister. Their suffering is our suffering. So, while how Muslims treat Muslims in Muslim countries is irrelevant as you say, how they treat Christians (and other minorities, including Jews) is. In fact, I would say, that Christians (and possibly Buddhists and Bah'ais) are probably the only religious groups in the world who care about and indeed show and act upon a sense of responsibility for groups outside their own.

I used to agree with the sentiments qualis rex has expressed above.

Whilst I'm not indifferent to the suffering of outgroups and indeed quite saddened by what has happened to Iraqi Christians* since Iraq was "liberated" I believe realism requires a siege mentality with the non-Western world at this time in history. I would be far more likely to display empathy for non-Westerners if they weren't invading my part of the world.

The last part of your quote appears to be true. Could it also be the ultimate source of our liberal universalism? Or is it just a distortion of tradtional Christianity?

* Why insurgents murdered Iraqi archbishop

Afonso Henriques said...

For God sake Quali Rex, can't you get a little provocation without starting screaming and kicking all around you? Is "are you mad" really that offensive?

Haven't you noticed that maybe your comment was offensive to some as well or something in that line?
Please...

Natalie,

I kind of understand that guy. I think if we manage to control the violent types (although we may - as El Inglés - apologise some acts of violence) I think that the white power/nationalist types can be a good source for helping the West. I mean, haven't you noticed that parties like Vlaams Belang, the BNP, Lega Nord, the Sweden Democrats or to a lesser extent even the SVP in Switzerland or the Republican Party in the U.S.A. all derive from white power/nationalist groups?

They have potential. I think we should help them realising what is happening really in the world instead of despizing them quickly for us to show up (that "us" does not, by any means, means Gates of Vienna) and state, "we are against those fascist pigs!"

I think they have a good core because they are usually pro-Western/Europe and understand that something has really went wrong. Their big problem is that they have been eaten the dog's food.

[That is, they have eaten something (they are pro Western and know something is wrong) but not proper food (they can not understand the real causes of the problem and as so are made believe in some non sense theories) due to something that also went wrong along the way]

The thing is, if we analyse the e-mail, it is for sure condenable and stupidly anti-Jewish, blaming the Jews for everything, but there are some points of lucidity - and I don't mean that "the Jews made it", I mean, the one who sent the e-mail knows that somethings are really not okay - when the ones appoints evils as Abortion, the 1965 Immigration Reform Act, femininism and the like. Putting always Europe on front of every thing else.

All this to answer your last paragraph. The mail said:

"Viva Italia!!!
Viva Russia!!!
Hail the New Dawn!!!"

I myself could be the one saying this. Though I wouldn't certainly not have forget the Serbs!

It's because the only thing that the West/Europe may have some hopes - Nationalism, is more alive in Italy and Russia. The new dawn is the future this two (three with Serbia) countries may lead as to.

P.S.- And I personally have more faith in Russia than Italy because Italy is too democratic and to European...

Russia will apear more and more the saviour of Europe as you Americans seem to be enjoying your crazy and savage and auto destructive Capitalism, trading democracy for oil and electing women and blacks just because they are women or black. By now it is certain, the man is black, an islamic black with a scaring life story...

I believe you've caught my drift.

Joanne said...

Viva Italia!!!
Viva Russia!!!


???????

This person should really check out Revelation and Ezekiel before aligning themselves with the Italians and Russians.

Baron Bodissey said...

Rier --

I get a lot of nasty email that I don't publish. That particular one was so outrageous I had to post it.

Share the load, you know... :)

I think it's useful to demonstrate that a lot of folks don't consider us to be neo-Nazis, in contrast to what some others think.

Ypp said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
kbarrett said...

Alphonso:

"are you mad?" is a personal insult.

"your opinion is mad" is not.

It doesn't take all that much care to be civil ... just a little.

Just my $0.02. Do with it as you will.

IoshkaFutz said...

Ciao Johanne,

What did old Zeke say about the dangers of aligning oneself with Italians? The next time my German wife gives me hell, instead of just saying "I never promised you a rose garden," I want to pull out the Bible and tell her that God himself had warned her!

Are there any such Biblical warnings against Slovaks or Cubans? IMHO (backed up by experience) there ought to be.

Ypp said...

2 Alfonso

You deliberately cut my phrase in order to change its meaning.

Could you honestly say, what you want for whites: power or survival?

Whiskey said...

Alfonso the Republican Party never has and never will be aligned with or associated with "white power groups."

Recall a man named Lincoln? Emancipation Proclamation? The 1964 Civil Rights act, passed with support of Republicans? Mitt Romney's father marched in support of Civil Rights in the 1960's, when it was unpopular to do so. Ike sent troops to Little Rock to enforce de-segregation.

The Republican Party is on balance, barely POPULIST. Populism != "white nationalism." In fact, it is quite opposed to it. However, Populism holds traditions, values, morality of the nation and the people sacred, as it forms the binding ties that produce unity among the people. Thanksgiving, Fourth of July, the Flag, the Armed Forces, the Bill of Rights, the history of the nation and it's heroes all mean something. They are to be valued as a sacred heritage. This is NOT White Nationalism and is in fact opposed to it on every level. As George Washington's letter to the Synagoge in Rhode Island makes clear.

Anti-Semitism is the disease of the mind, in which pressed and disturbed peoples and elites seek to blame some group for modernism. In SE Asia, diaspora Chinese take the same role. The same social dynamic -- modernity uproots traditions, mores, social organization, traditional society, and so "someone must be blamed" rather than the impersonal forces of the market and consumerism.

It is worth noting that Denmark, Italy, and Fascist Bulgaria did the least to send Jews to the Gas Chambers and most to save them. Why? Because the future was comfortable and comforting for modernist Danes, who went from rural poverty to comfortable middle class wealth in a few generations. Italians and Bulgarians, stuck in the mud of rural poverty, desperately wanted to join the future, where they could be both richer and no longer at the mercy of more powerful neighbors simply taking things from them. For them, the Jews symbolizing Modernity were good things, things they wanted and sought overall to protect. Their traditional society was viewed as a prison they wanted to get out of, and Jews the key to unlock the prison.

If one wishes to kill anti-Semitism, one must make people be more like Danes, Italians, and Bulgarians. Either very comfortable with existing modernity or eager to get out of traditional society "prisons."

IoshkaFutz said...

Ciao Whiskey,

For the Italians of that period, Fascism represented modernity and certainly not the Jews. The futurists who adored speed and machinery were Fascists... Italy won world records in aviation, the swamps were cleared and turned into arable land, there were all sorts of reforms.

Plenty of Italian Jews were sent to the death camps, but plenty were also saved, but that had absolutely nothing to do with a desire for emulation.

That came in after the war when it was fashionable to copy the Americans (who through Hollywood movies had been admired even in the Fascist period, until the movies and the music was banned).

Hence the song "Tu vo' fa l'Americano"

I don't know where you came up with the idea that Italians wanted to be modern like Jews.

Afonso Henriques said...

Ypp,
it depends on what you consider "power" to be. As I see it, Europe and Europeans started to "have power" since Rome and have never given power up. Power does not mean opression.

I think that Europeans don't matter what, will continue to be the the "force of progress". I may am being ethnocentric, but which society has rivelled with Europe?
More than that, the destruction of Europe, or great problems in Europe, will be as bad to mankind as a whole as to Europeans as a Civilisation. I can attest examples as the Conquest of the Iberian Peninsula, the Byzantine Empire and Eastern Europe by the Islamic hordes of Arabs, Berbers, Turks and Mongols. But this three events were worst to non European Humanity than to Europeans because Europeans have managed to surpass what happened.

Well, a little mixture of genes and exogenous cultural differences can be in part considered by some as somehow defeats of the "older" Europe but I think that Portugal, Spain and Greece are still European countries and that it is beyond doubt, and that the Alhambra and the architeture in the Algarve are beautifull, and European as well because you can not find something like that in the muslim world. One thing that Europe has truly lost (it seems for ever) was Constantiople. Bosnia and Cyprus for example are somehow temporary muslim enclaves: the Croatians and the Serbs will kick the muslims out of there (there are 15 million Chistians to two million muslims surrouding by Christians from every corner).

But let's look to the impacts of such "draw-backs" in Europes on the non-Europeans.

The Invasion of Portugal and Spain led directly to the beggining of European Colonialism;

The Invasion of Eastern Europe led directly to the Russian conquest of Central and Eastern Asia and its expansion to the South.

The invasion of the Byzantine Empire led to a greater flow of Greek-Byzantine know-how to the West that would strenghten European power to be used against non Europeans.

The conflicts that have weakened Europe considerably are intra-European conflicts (ex: WWII) and I honestly think that we don't have to chose between "power" and "survival".

As I see it, European Nations, or European derived Nations but specially the former, should be aloud to continue with its Traditional ethnical balance respecting the principle of the Nation State (ethnically clean), that is, Europe free from multiculturalism. From this we would assure European survival. Europeans would have children and no threats (at least ethnical, the kind of threats that can change a Nation forever because if France becomes 75% non French tomorrow, it will difficultly still be called France. And France will be lost for ever...) and if they did not, the State would incentivate Europeans to reproduce themselves.

All other Nations (but the Europeans) are aloud to be "ethnically pure" even if for that, we have to close our eyes to what happens in Darfur and China or worst, Zimbabwe or South Africa, where Europe closes her eyes to the mass murder of Europeans...

Continuing my reasoning, from this point, "power" would naturally follow. Answering honestly, it depends on what you consider survival. I want power in our Nations and survival world wide.

Its a vicious cycle because for survival we need to have power in our Nations and only that power would assure a "survival" at the wotld scale. But once we have survival, we will instantly get power.

For me white power basicly stands for the rejection of multiculturalism in European lands. I think that one is acting in favour of the West, or of European Civilisation, he/she is proportionating white power...

I hope I was able to answer you ypp. If not, please tell me where I did failed and I'll try to explain my view again.

Afonso Henriques said...

Whyskey,

Considering the Republican Party, I will not feed polemics but I said that they derived from...
In that time everybody was white nationalist because the model to follow in the New World was to establish all white Nations. There was a group who dreemed of a all white America, and I mean white, I don't mean simply European. Me, Italians, Irish, Eastern Europeans and the like would be excluded from that America. It is in this line that I said that the Republican party derives from white power types. Also, I would not want to enter the polemics of Lincoln wanting to sent all of African descent to Liberia - which was the more humane thing to do, they would live in their comunity, in their country instead of being a poor and handicaped minority. White Americans would be better off as well... but I don't want to go there... really.

Then you speak about anti-Semitism. I think anti-Semitism has a reason to exist. I am not justifying it, all I am saying is that the Jewish community is not perfect and as such has reasons to be "hated" or "looked down". This is not anti-Semitism. The British look down to the French, the Germans to the Poles, etc etc but only when we hate Jews is that it becomes a problem.

But REAL anti Semitism is worst than that. I think that Jews, for being an easy target, and because they have seen as foreigners and "looked down" for some aspects, are the perfect "scape goaths".

Thus, when there is something one can not explain, there will always be someone who will blame the Jews for it.
Actually, I am quiet astonished for not have already heard of that Jew who controles the UFOs and stuff...

It's like when Afrocentrists don't find nothing to be proud of and then start proclaiming that the black man invented the Ferrari, painted the Mona Lisa and was the first to go to the moon.
It's irrational but the European equivalent to this usually is blaming the Jew. This really is Anti-Semitism. But there is so much mere criticism of the Jews that is branded as Anti-Semitism that it is appaling.

thll said...

Surprised to see so much hot air expelled on a caricature. It reminded me, in a funny sort of a way, of the Muslim outrage at the Motoons...

Morgan said...

What I don't understand is how those individuals who are anti-Semitic Jew-haters could be ATTRACTED to anti-jihad rhetoric? By all logic, they should be finding PRO-JIHAD rhetoric more appealing.

Ypp said...

2 Alfonso

You say, you stand for civilization and progress. But currently, the only Western country that is trying to spread progress and civilization is USA, lead by neocons who you hate so much. I don't claim that it is a wise policy, because I don't know. But it seems to me that you try to attribute all progress to one half of the West, and blame all problems on its another half.

W.LindsayWheeler said...

They call St. Clement an anti-semite. Does St. Clement suffer from a mental disease? Do Jews that have Teutonophobia normal but goys that have judenhass have a mental disease? Ever read the Talmud and the nasty said in there by us goys? Anti-goyism in the Talmud is "normal" but judenhass in the goys is a disease?

I get it The Double Standard produced by the Eastern Double Mind.

The Bible teaches that the Jews are to wander. To support the State of Israel is to oppose the Will of God.

Ypp said...

2 lindsaywheeler

You definitely did not read neither the Bible, because you write nonsense, nor Talmud.

By the way, the Bible did not say a single world about you, whoever you are. Does that mean that your existence is a mistake?

Natalie said...

Afonso, you make interesting points. I don't like white nationalist/white supremacist groups because they are pro-Western on racial grounds. This is completely wrong in my view because I support the West and the counter-jihad movement on ideological grounds.

Still, if a civil war broke out, and I think it's only a matter of time before it does, I suppose it might be wise to have as many people on our side as possible, even if we had our differences with them (i.e. white nationalists). As Abraham Lincoln said, "A friend is one who has the same enemies as you have."

I don't think the Republican Party derives power from white nationalist groups. I'm American, and I definitely haven't seen that. The BNP definitely does, but I don't really like them because of their Holocaust denial. I really don't think the VB does either, and as for the other parties you mentioned, I can't speak for them because I don't know enough about them.

About the Russia thing, I just pointed that out because I thought it was kind of random for the person who wrote the email to include it. And I'm not sure how you see Russia being the "savior of Europe" - it seems to me that they don't really fight back against the Muslims who wage jihad against them.

As an American, I like democracy and capitalism, but I am also very frustrated about our upcoming election. I was devastated when Barack Hussein got the nomination and I despair when I see how much support he has. The man is incredibly dangerous, as I'm sure you've realised. I don't really understand what you mean about your comment "trading democracy for oil." Perhaps you can elaborate more?

About your later comment to someone else about anti-Semitism: I thought it was interesting. The Jewish community isn't perfect because, after all, no one's perfect - we're all human. But as soon as you point that out, you get labeled an anti-Semite. Understand that I'm not blaming the Jews for everything or anything like that - it's just an awkward situation. Because of the Holocaust, sometimes people get overly sensitive about criticism to the Jews even when it is justified. Even the topic of the Jews in general is sometimes awkward because of the Holocaust.

That being said, I still think that person who wrote the email is an idiot.

And what's with the "Hail the New Dawn!!!" thing? I meant to ask that earlier... is it some white supremacist thing I'm unaware of?

Darrin Hodges said...

The interesting nexus between the far left and far right meets around the back of the "circle".

Have a guess at who said this:

"Let us consider the actual, worldly Jew -- not the Sabbath Jew, as Bauer does, but the everyday Jew. Let us not look for the secret of the Jew in his religion, but let us look for the secret of his religion in the real Jew. What is the secular basis of Judaism? Practical need, self-interest. What is the worldly religion of the Jew? Huckstering. What is his worldly God? Money. Very well then! Emancipation from huckstering and money, consequently from practical, real Jewry, would be the self-emancipation of our time.... We recognize in Jewry, therefore, a general present-time-oriented anti-social element, an element which through historical development -- to which in this harmful respect the Jews have zealously contributed -- has been brought to its present high level, at which it must necessarily dissolve itself. In the final analysis, the emancipation of the Jews is the emancipation of mankind from Jewry".

hint: its not who you think.

W.LindsayWheeler said...

For your info YPP please look up the Neutrai Karta, a traditionalist Orthodox group who still teach the tradition.

The Jews are to wander. That is their punishment laid down in Deuteronomy Chapter 28 for not obeying the word of God. I know my Bible very well, thank you very much.

The Jews have a covenant with God--They had to adhere to EVERY word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. Jesus is Mouth of God. Jesus is the logos. The Jews have rejected the Word of God---"And it shall come to pass when all these things shall have come upon thee, the blessing AND THE C-U-R-S-E, which I have set before thy face, and thou shalt call them to mind among the nations, wherein the Lord shall have scattered thee..." LXX, Deut. 30.1

What the Lord Scattered, let no man gather. The Jews have not repented of their deicide, have not faced their crime, and they have not "hearkened to the Word of God" which is Jesus Christ. For this reason, the Lord Scattered them. To uphold, defend, advocate the state of Israel is an affront to God. This is not the will of God.

Mr. Smarterthanyou said...

It is possible to support Israel, as a democracy in the ME, while at the same time notice that every major anti-American, anti-Christian and anti-Capitalist group operating in the west was founded by and currently overwhelmingly supported by Jews. If we want to understand why public displays of the Christian religion are under attack in the US, all you have to do is note that the person(s) attacking them are Jews who object to Christianity.

Noticing this is bad? Evil? I would suggest that not mentioning Judaism in the ongoing culture war is like not mentioning race when it comes to violent crime in the US, or Islam in the European rape epidemic. Maybe it makes things more "comfortable", but for certain you give up on solving the problem.

The problem isn't all Jews, but the 90% of them that are leftist. Liberal Jews fear Muslims, but like the moth to the flame they circle their way to their deaths. But they HATE Christians, because they know that they cannot face up to Christian moral standards. They would take the Muslim as their ally in the fight against Christianity, partly thinking that they can control the Muslim, but subconsciously knowing that the Muslim will end their "guilt" for them in the end.

Keep the support of Israel prominent on your page, but don't flinch every time someone points out the sick linkages between Liberal Jews and the culture war.