Here’s his translation of an article from last Friday’s De Telegraaf, followed by his own commentary:
Webmaster is punishable for extremism- - - - - - - - -
ZUTPHEN — Owners and managers of websites can be held responsible if visitors to their sites place extremist texts on it.
The magistrate [‘politie rechter’; lowest court level] sentenced the manager of the site ‘rechtser.com’ to a fine of €750, from which €250 is probational. Contrary to other similar cases, the condemned hadn’t written the offending texts himself, but merely forgotten to remove them.
According to the MDI the sentence is a step forward in addressing digital discrimination. “The judge clearly indicated that the contents of texts placed on sites are the responsibility of the manager,” said MDI director Niels van Tamelen.
The organization tipped the department of Justice about the offending texts on the site. “Important is the signature (political style) of the site. The manager placed negative news items about Muslims and links to extremist sites. He could therefore expect that punishable texts would be placed on his site, and he had address that.”
According to councilor Bertjan Souman from Epe a slippery slope has appeared: “The site was for some time actively controlled by my client. He wasn’t able to manage it properly due to a lot of work. He only found out something was wrong when he was arrested. The writers of the offending articles were not prosecuted by the police at all.”
H. Numan’s commentary:
It appears to be just a minor news item, but it most certainly is not. Freedom of speech was thoroughly axed by the court. Of course the writer of an article is responsible for his article. The publisher is not, or at least to a much lesser extent.
What has happened is the creation of a precedent: a relatively unknown website run by a non-famous person met the full wrath of multicultural (in)justice. The sentence may seem light, but is far from it. €750 is a lot of money. What people may or may not know is that most Dutch people have insurance to cover lawsuits, but… this insurance only covers civil litigation. Criminal lawsuits are not covered by insurance. The lawyer’s fee (€200 per hour) is therefore not covered, not even for such a clearly incompetent lawyer as Mr. (Meester, the title for a Dutch graduate in law) Bertjan Souman is. I have no idea how much a lawyer would charge for this bumbling piece of work — if you can call it even work — but at least 20 to 40 hours, if not more. Which is about four full months’ wages for the webmaster in question.
In America it is maybe possible to pay a lawyer according to results (I am not familiar with US law), or possibly tell this incompetent nincompoop to fleece somebody else. This is not the case in the Netherlands. You pay. Regardless of the outcome.
Why incompetent? First of all the MDI, which in Holland is nicknamed “the thought Gestapo”, ‘forgot’ to inform the webmaster about the offending items, and give him some time to remove them. The webmaster only found out something was wrong when he was arrested by the police. A lawyer worth hissaltgold would have pushed for an innocent verdict. He didn’t, as it seems. The judge seems to have forgotten to mention this extremely relevant point in his ruling. It is more than likely that an appeal would change the verdict dramatically. However, an appeal costs money. A lot of money. A lot of money the webmaster simply doesn’t have.
Now consider the double standard applied: some items may be offensive, sure. But why does the MDI not apply the same standards on www.maroc.nl? Almost daily people post much more offensive texts on that forum; they cheer and rejoice if Dutch (or American) soldiers die in Afghanistan, and pray it will be better next time (better = more soldiers’ deaths). The number of highly offensive postings on this board about the resentment those people feel about the country they are born in (!) is almost countless. But not one single posting, nor a webmaster or moderator has been charged. It is not likely that one will be.
Read the underlined sentence “Important is the signature (political style) of the site” again. What is the message here? We judge a site on what we, the MDI, find acceptable or not. If the site is considered acceptable by us (based on what grounds?), anything goes. As is obviously the case with maroc.nl. If the site is considered by us as not acceptable? We will find, just as the Cheka did under Stalin, reasons to kill it.
The MDI together with the ministry of Justice twice attacked far too well-known sites: first Gregorius Nekschot, then GeenStijl. In both cases they had to give in, and lose a lot of face. Not so in this case. Which means that the precedent has been created, and based on this ruling bloggers can be muzzled almost without restriction.
Recently I met a few Dutch upper-class retirees who fully believe in the absolute justice of the legal system we have in the Netherlands. They refused to even listen to or consider anything negative about it. It is the very best in the world! Frankly speaking I don’t agree. I think the judges are rather biased to say the least and if you are neither a pauper nor very rich, it is next to impossible to apply for an appeal.
Not only the webmaster, but Lady Justice was raped in court.
Additional information sources:
dag.nl
De Pers
demorgen.be
digitaal media
Flitsservice
fok.nl
Logfather.com
marokko.nl
MSN nieuws
nieuws.nl
nieuwsbank.nl
nu.nl
politiekdebat.nl
rechtsspraak.nl
Stentor
teleblog.nl
Telegraaf
TV gelderland
weerwoord.nl
zaplog.nl
17 comments:
What this means is that Dutch authorities are giving in to demands from Islamic countries and are kneeling at the feet of their new Muslim masters. There can be no doubt that there is considerable political pressure on the police and others to enforce Multicultural speech codes and silence dissenters among the natives.
Since we see clearly that Muslims can post negative remarks about the natives, but the natives are not allowed to post negative remarks about Islamic culture, this means that the natives are de facto second-rate citizens in their own country. This is coincidentally the status that they are supposed to have according to sharia law, which means that the authorities are now enforcing sharia law.
We had a case in Utrecht where the Dutch natives protested against violence from immigrant gangs. They were immediately crushed by the authorities, who do nothing to protect the natives against immigrant violence.
The same thing happened in Brussels, where gangs of Muslim immigrants harass the natives on a daily basis. We have had several recent cases where native girls have been gang raped by immigrants in the heart of the EU capital, yet when the natives wanted to protest against the Islamization of their continent, the demonstration was banned by the Socialist mayor of Brussels, whose ruling party is heavily infiltrated by Muslims. Those who attempted to carry on with a peaceful protest were arrested by the police.
These incidents demonstrate that the elites and the authorities throughout Western Europe are now dedicated to implementing continued mass immigration and Multiculturalism no matter what the natives think. If they object, they will be silenced. The Dutch voted "no" to the proposed EU Constitution, as did the Irish and the French voters, but they are simply ignored. At the same time, the EU elites obediently respond to calls from Islamic countries to ban "stereotypes and prejudice" targeting Islam.
This shows that the European political elites implement the agendas of our enemies and ignore the interests of their own people. They are thus collaborators and traitors and should be treated accordingly. The problem is that they currently feel quite comfortable and secure. They fear the reactions of Muslims, but despise their own people who they view as sheep, existing only to provide them with champagne and nice cars and to be guinea pigs in their grandiose social experiments.
Change will only come when they fear the anger of native Europeans more than they fear Muslims. This means that we must put pressure on them. We should prepare lists of dhimmi collaborators and make perfectly clear that these people are going to stand trial for what they have done. They should not be allowed to hide in the Bahamas with our tax money when the shit hits the fan.
On a practical level - did anyone write to appropriate politicians (like Council of Europe) and request action on this violation of fundamental rights in a European country?
A member list, which consists of MP's from all of Europe, can be found here.
Take your pick :)
I believe we are getting more and more ridiculous by the hour: we are unable to accept and internalize the simple fact that the EU citizenry voted for these lawmakers and their policies in overwhelming numbers and - apart from a few fringe groups and disaffected blogs - apparently they are content with the corollaries of their votes and actions. There was no mass protest against Solana and Co. Ever. Anyplace.
They succumbed to the cherished Socialism, willful Islamisation and loss of freedom of expression bereft of duress or the threat of it should they refuse to comply; - without hiccups or growling.
For American posters what is the point of joining a Quixotic struggle which attracts no mass support in the EU; - quite the opposite is true for the reflexive, overt Anti-Americanism is the cool thing for the European mind. The newest fad is to convert the EU into Russian vassal continent and a disparaging remark as per Russia is inferred as sacrilege and promptly condemned and such.
All these simple facts are covered and shrouded in high flying intellectual blabbering, long sentences where words carry no other meaning than soothing lullaby for adults. The disintegration of the cognitive mind is unstoppable.
What is the common tread between the US and the EU - apart from some nostalgic yearning for times long gone by?
Not much.
Anyone who follows the thread presented on these forums can enjoy long essay on how to exterminate "inadequate" individuals who committed no crimes, other spewing outrages against the US, NATO and other nations sympathetic to her, the renamed KGB is the shining castle and its owner who single-handedly tamed a Siberian tiger and saved many newsmen by his heroism.
I believe we on the other side of the Atlantic better concentrate on our life and destiny and let the Europeans swim or sink without our participation.
Freedom of Speech is dead. All those who fought and died for the freedoms are turning over in their graves; talk about dying in vain.
Bela, a tad offended..?
Now, for Putin and the tiger, don't take it at face value. I suspect it to be staged.
As for KGB being a 'shiny castle', your sarcasm is going way over the edge. That's a nasty slur to throw around against your imaginary opponents here. You can do better than that.
When I'm critical of the US neocon-style foreign policy, it's because I believe it's bad for the US, for Europe and for the world at large. Sure, the US - and it's president in particular - has every kind of right to start any war anywhere. Except that they don't.
Starting wars is serious business, international law is (in particular since the Peace of Westphalia) constructed to prevent starting wars of aggression. There are ways around it, and the US administration masters those ways just fine.
There's also a severe constitutional bond on declaring war, in that the US Congress has the right to do so, not the President. Which in principle means the US has not been involved in any war since WWII, for none have been declared. It's all just 'intervention'.
War is a last resort. But the US, not least by the example of Bill Cliton, resorts to that solution way too often. It empties the coffers of the US government and breeds enemies where we need friends. It's not good for us.
Bela: Don't see why you attack this blog, which is one of the most anti-Socialist websites around. I have indicated many times that we should copy the First and the Second Amendments from the Americans. I see no reason to copy your immigration policies, which could very well cause the USA to collapse and be split into several countries in the not-too-distant future.
fjordman,
I am not attacking this blog and I have never gotten involved with immigration policies of the US. My line of expertise is Marxism-Leninism, life under Soviet occupation, life in the Marxist prison systems, who is who in the New-Left for no other reason than I am a survivor of the Red Terror.
And Marxism is not dead but resurrected and alive.
I merely drew attention to the fact that some bloggers bring up bizarre subject like exterminating people for loss of virginity, others express virulent, overt Anti-Americanism and hatred towards Eastern Europeans for their support of the States.
Others resent using harsh words against Russia but America bashing is OK and encouraged (using refined, turgid diction).
These are documented facts from which I deduced that Americans have very little shared premises with these world views presented herein.
With due respect to your astute contribution to these blogs I don't understand your objection to my thesis concerning the EU general policy.
The voters elected and supported those bureaucrats, nobody rebelled, everybody complies, only a small group of bloggers protest.
If this is the EU Majority's opinion then isn't Quixotic for Americans to attempt at changing Europe's destiny?
Bela: What is the common tread between the US and the EU - apart from some nostalgic yearning for times long gone by?
Both are under the thumb of George Soros? Side by side in the stupid march of deranged altruism.
I believe we on the other side of the Atlantic better concentrate on our life and destiny and let the Europeans swim or sink without our participation.
Yes thanks, stay away. If you can somehow manage to get America to stay out of European affairs altogether, I will send you a box of chocolate. Start with removing your troops out of Germany.
Bela: "Marxism is not dead but resurrected and alive."
I am well aware of that, and would in fact be very interested in hearing your views on the resurgence of various neo-Marxist doctrines in the Western world. This carries much more weight coming from those who have actually lived under Communist regimes.
Some people think I write too much about Marxism, but I honestly believe it is one of the main causes of the weakness of Western Europeand the Western world in general. Perhaps Eastern Europeans are somewhat more resistant to cultural Marxism because they have already been exposed to its more violent twin.
fjordman,
1.Our expertise is encompassing about 50 years of psychical Marxism-Leninism from the last years of Stalin's through the Khrushchev-Brezhnev era OUTSIDE the URSS, but INSIDE the vassal states of the Warsaw pact.
____________________________________________________
Since philosophical threads tend to be utterly boring for the laymen I try to condense it as much as it's possible and will return to the subject when need arises.
"Perhaps Eastern Europeans are somewhat more resistant to cultural Marxism because they have already been exposed to its more violent twin."
You're right.
The Cultural Marxism is an invention by the Leftist A. Gramsci and G. Lukacs to destroy the WESTERN Capitalism.
Since under URSS occupation there was NO capitalism in the Eastern Block to be destroyed thus the Cultural Marxism never came to existence over there and contemporary Easterners never heard of it either.
How did it work?
"Proletariat of the world Unified!"
It excludes diversity: if you are different you go to Gulag.
One Party system:
opposition hanged or Gulag.
Multiculturalism:
Mandatory Russian language, history, geography, Party's history, Marx, Lenin, Stalin thought in ALL Warsaw Block countries. (I had to learn Russian too.)Hence my expertise.
Immigration:
No one in or out: The Iron Curtain.
Homosexuals: prosecuted (if in secret, tolerated)
Press: All Typewriters banned, later permitted under restrictions: only communist party members could buy.
Anything multiplied in excess of 5 examples considered as violation of the law (publishing without permit) and Gulag.
The Institutions of Block Wardens:
An official civilian in every city block to keep an eye on every and each individual and report anything that might be suspicious.
The Word Warden:
Civil individuals to listen to your words and use it against you at the political trials.
My Word Warden was a waiter at my favorite coffee shop: I got 2 years Gulag for my words.
Remember Kipling's word:
East is East, West is West.
__________________________________________
Cultural Marxism is for Westerners only!
Bela: "My Word Warden was a waiter at my favorite coffee shop: I got 2 years Gulag for my words."
That's terrible to hear. We don't have a Gulag here, yet, but I'm sure the EU is working on the issue. The ridiculous show trials they had in al-Canada recently is a bad sign.
"The Cultural Marxism is an invention by the Leftist A. Gramsci and G. Lukacs to destroy the WESTERN Capitalism. Since under URSS occupation there was NO capitalism in the Eastern Block to be destroyed thus the Cultural Marxism never came to existence over there and contemporary Easterners never heard of it either."
This corresponds with the views we have expressed at this blog before:
Political Correctness — The Revenge of Marxism
I have heard people who have grown up in former Communist countries say that we in the West are at least as brainwashed by Multiculturalism and Political Correctness as they ever were with Communism, perhaps more so. Even in the heyday of the East Bloc, there were active dissident groups in these countries. The scary thing is, I sometimes believe they are right.
A Norwegian newspaper called Dagens Næringsliv exposed the fact that the largest “anti-racist” organization in the country, SOS Rasisme, was heavily infiltrated by Communists and extreme Leftists. They infiltrated the organization in the late 1980s and early ’90s, in other words, during the downfall of Communism in Eastern Europe. They went directly from Communism to Multiculturalism, which should indicate that at least some of them viewed Multiculturalism as the continuation of Communism by other means. It speaks volumes about the close connection between economic Marxism and cultural Marxism. They just have different means of reaching the same ends.
Absolutely agree with Fjordman about this non-tangible Marxism, which by the names of 'Multiculturalism', 'Cultural relativism' or even 'Humanism' is dismantling our will to stand for our identity and our countries.
It's just all around, in the opinions one is 'supposed' to have, and difficult to contradict, for fear of being stigmatized.
After Islam and the European Union, I think this will be the third challenge of my lifetime. That should do - then I'll want a break :)
fjordman,
Now is clear that for many Westerners I am -(along with other Easterners)- a sort of super-gadfly who disturbs their convoluted, hodge-podge romanticized daydreaming of the Elysian Fields that Marxism and Russia and Putin (Commie or Fascist doesn't matter) will bring about.
Real witnesses of History, the survivors of mayhem represent a nasty challenge to their smug satisfaction: they consider themseves as sparkling "intellectuals".
Oh mon Dieu! Quelle horreur!
fjordman,
your link is an excellent general reference on the subject of Political Correctness. Since G. Lukacs, one of the original founders was Hungarian just like I am and Hungary was the first and only Communist country outside Russia I have a very keen interest in the Marxist plague that infests the West.
Abstract, scholarly analysis is too heavy for ordinary people to digest, so I go for the Individuals akin to Frontpagemag's "Discover the network" - of course only within the American context for I don't know who is who in Europe.
Bela: I understand your frustration. And yes, Fascism and Socialism are two sides of the same coin. Hayek understood that. Mr. Putin is a product of the old Soviet system. He's not my favorite. I like Mr. Bukovsky a lot more, and I notice that some of those coming from former Communist countries see the EU more clearly for what it is. This is also why it is so sad to see many of these countries join the EU, too.
If we think of Europe as a whole, the stronghold of European civilization could well be in east-central Europe in the future, as parts of Western Europe will possibly disintegrate into civil wars. But the eastern half of the continent is not immune to cultural Marxism, either, when it is mandatory in the EU system. It is of vital importance that we get rid of the EU so that at least some parts of Europe can survive this and hopefully recover.
I would be very interested in hearing your views on the future prospects of the former Communist countries. I would also be interested in hearing your thoughts on what a good society is, and how it should be organized. I have given a lot of thought recently to the separation of church and state in the West. This paved the way for greater political liberty later, but it was never intentionally created to do so. In other words: One of the greatest inventions in European history was unplanned. In contrast, the Communist societies in Eastern Europe planned the entire society down to the last detail, and they failed miserably.
The lesson is: You cannot plan everything and shouldn't try. Yet the EU is now doing this same mistake, only in a slightly different way. That is why calling it the EUSSR is more than just a joke.
fjordman,
" But the eastern half of the continent is not immune to cultural Marxism, either, when it is mandatory in the EU system."
You are mistaken in this regard: as you know I am not mincing words and I prefer to be harsh only to underscore my point. Eastern Europeans are not "gentleman"-like people like Westerners. They are uncivil and savages ( I am too): remember the Balkans, no amount of bloody Russian oppression stopped the Hungarians to rebel in 56, so did the Czech in 68, the Poles all the times...
These people are hard headed and rough, immune to the niceties of the Western "intellectuals"; unless you curse and use vulgar expressions they don't even understand what the hell are you talking about.
Multiculturalism? They beat up the Gypsies on the spot, homosex parade and ministerial speeches receives a downpour of eggs...
"The U.S. ambassador to Hungary, April H. Foley, She issued a statement "deploring" violence against the Gay Pride parade in Budapest on July 5."
http://www.washingtontimes.com/
_______________________________________________
"US ambassador denounces racism in Hungary.
Racist remarks can be made without any consequences in Hungary, and ethnic minorities can be humiliated and insulted here, US ambassador April H. Foley said in a statement after she met minority rights ombudsman Ernő Kállai on Friday."
___________________________________________
No amount of EU brainwashing will change the prevailing mentality regardless whether it's good or bad or disgusting. When I was in E. Europe last year nobody talked about the EU; the farther you are from the center the less influence you have over distant events.
Not to be tedious and bloviating I took note of your questions and I will reply during the course of future treads.
I believe we are getting more and more ridiculous by the hour: we are unable to accept and internalize the simple fact that the EU citizenry voted for these lawmakers and their policies in overwhelming numbers and - apart from a few fringe groups and disaffected blogs - apparently they are content with the corrollaries of their votes and actions.
I agree. As an American, this is what it looks like to me, too. The fact that this obscure webmaster is arrested and charged with a criminal offense (this, along with many more reports from Europe), indicates that Europe's sickness may be, at this point, incurable. I can't envision the mass of European people doing anything seriously effective to turn the tide.
Henrik Clausen provides a good example of why I feel this way. He seems to have the idea that Pres. Bush started the Iraq war all by his lonesome. I assure you that would not have been possible. The war in Iraq did not happen without the supporting votes of the US Congress.
Starting wars is serious business, international law is (in particular since the Peace of Westphalia) constructed to prevent starting wars of aggression.
Okay. So you can't start wars. Why not? Because there's a law! And it's constructed to prevent starting wars of aggression! Unfortunately, the mere existence of international law accomplishes nothing without the threat of force to back it up. The threat of force is the willingness to use force. The Europeans' unwillingness to use force renders law meaningless. The US, contrary to European opinion, has not been eager to use force. But it has been willing to use it, and that willingness has provoked Europe's undying derision and contempt.
The UN passed 16 resolutions against Saddam Hussein, each one successively flaunted and ignored. Forget about whether or not the Iraq war was right or wrong, the point I'm making is that, had the US not invaded Iraq, the UN would currently be working on UN Resolution #2,368. Is that how ridiculous it must be allowed to get? Yes, say the Europeans.
The problem with these precious and useless international bodies is that, when a brutal tyrant acts up, they love to say what should be done - e.g., fill-in-the-blank must stop - but woe betide the nation that actually does what they say should be done. Europe hates and vilifies US action because it's unfair for there to be a lone superpower. It violates the rules of equality. This is the European mindset. Too much faith in words on pieces of paper.
And yet, oddly enough, some European posters here seem to be expecting that Europeans will become so angry about their societal suicide that sooner or later civil war will inevitably break out. Ha ha, that'll be the day. I won't be holding my breath.
Don't misunderstand me. I'm not sitting here in the US being smug. Free speech is endangered here too. Just the other day I heard Obama (and I'm paraphrasing here, I can't recall the exact quote) saying something like, "Yes, we have First Amendment rights, but along with those rights come responsibilities." Meaning, responsibilities not to smear, not to insult, not to offend, not to hurt anyone's feelings. This is the reasonable-sounding wedge they mean to use to clamp down on free expression in the US. If Obama wins the election, we Americans will have many opportunities to catch up with the Europeans.
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