Tuesday, December 15, 2009

F Street

Takuan Seiyo returns with an examination of the behavior of radical Jewish leftists — whom I often call “suicide Jews” — and the harm that they do, both to the Jewish community in America and to the West at large.


F Street
by Takuan Seiyo


This is a new initiative. It will be called F Street, in cadence with J Street. The latter is a lefto-Jewish PAC working in good faith to destroy via its hallucinatory delusions the very object of its tender concern: Israel.

The F stands for Fool, and F Street will be an effort to advocate with respect to group foolishness that harms America and works to destroy the fools themselves first. K Street, for kamikaze, would have been apt, but the K is famously taken.

Typical subjects for this column might be like the Julia Gorin classic “To Serve Man”, reports on Feminist organizations promoting the spread of sharia in the West, or anything Mike Huckabee. Another good candidate would be accounts of the activities of Protestant church groups resettling Somali refugees among Eloi Midwestern Nordics in order to reap, a generation later, this [now removed from YouTube, available here] predictable harvest.

Content contributors to F Street ought to know their subject, have no related biases, and have the required teflon coating to ward off volleys of “racist,” “anti-Semite,” “homophobe” and other such projectiles that will be coming at them 120 mph. For the particular strain of dhimmo-lunacy that interests us on F Street is shared disproportionately by Jews, mainstream Protestants, single women, the GBLT community, academics, West Germans, and Scandinavians.

Birther billboardWe begin on November 23, 2009. Phil Wolf, a car dealer in Wheat Ridge, Colorado, erects an anti-Obama sign and explains, “Since Fort Hood, I’ve had it. You can’t suggest things. You can’t profile. You gotta call a spade a spade. Everything I have read about Mr. Obama points right to the fact that he is a Muslim. And that is the agenda of what Muslim is all about. It’s about anti-American, it’s about anti-Christianity.”

Maybe it’s not the most eloquent way of putting it. The birth certificate issue is perhaps a misfire akin to going after Bill Clinton’s sex life. There have been far more consequential issues in both cases. But the feeling this billboard conveys may be shared by a hundred million Americans — such as those who queue at 5AM for a Sarah Palin book signing or a handshake with Glenn Beck. And their numbers grows in proportion to the volume of the gaseous Saul Alinsky genie hovering above the White House, all the pretending that Saul is Paul notwithstanding.

But let’s get back to our story. According to the KDVR Channel 31 report, “the ADL issued a statement calling the billboard an exploitation of the Ft. Hood shootings that is ‘divisive and offensive,’ and perpetuates hateful and harmful stereotypes about Muslims.”

It would be interesting to check how many Muslim organizations are reciprocally punctilious in stopping “hateful and offensive” stereotypes about Jews. But not a better friend has a Jew had among the gentiles in all of history than the sort of Christians who live in Colorado. The ADL might worry less about Muslim stereotypes, and more about stereotypes bolstered by people like this urinating on a figure two billion people consider the Son of God or at least the greatest man who ever lived.

ADL’s mission statement proclaims: “To stop the defamation of the Jewish people… to secure justice and fair treatment to all.” I have no quarrel with the first goal, and in the interest of brevity will avoid taking apart the second one. But when the ADL stokes the fires of resentment and alienation of the white Christian majority against the Jewish people, I see a serious problem.

ADL has a Hispanic/Latino Affairs section, which gives people the wrong idea that Benedict Arnold was Jewish. “Building and strengthening relationships with the Hispanic/Latino community in the fight against bigotry”, informs the ADL site, to take up the slack when Abe Foxman is too busy to pronounce that, “It is time to shine the spotlight on those who have seized upon the immigration debate as an opportunity to advance their agenda of hate, bigotry and white supremacy.”

The Hispanic/Latino community reciprocates as wholeheartedly as the Muslim one does. “An egregious Zionist assault on Academic Freedom at UCSB,” informs the Nation of Aztlan’s “Voice,” when it does not instruct that “Oprah Winfrey exposes Satanic Jewish Practices.”

In the alphabet soup of “Hispanic” and Jewish organizations united to decry “The Rise in Hate” that their own activity rises, La Raza is paramount. To get a better idea of what La Raza is, someone ought to skip from Spanish to German, for Abe Foxman’s sake, and say aloud with the proper Hochdeutsch accent, die Rasse. But even that would not begin to hint how richly the leadership of America’s Jewry has earned its retirement condo on F Street.

Consider the Radical Muslim terrorist-enabling project known otherwise as the Religious Worker Visa Program. “The Hebrew Immigrant Aid Society hailed the bill’s passage,” crows HIAS’s Web-page. A few more examples of this once-venerable institution’s flight into diminished-capacity clouds may be found here. Among them is the Progress by Pesach advocacy by 13 national Jewish organizations.

“What a joke for a program claiming to speak on behalf of American Jewry,” writes the (self-designated) “J-blogger,” The Kvetcher. “Let this be clear. The Jewish community does not perceive amnesty and an end to raids as ‘progress’ at all.”

Would it that people like that had a louder voice and a more public profile in the Jewish community. Alas, it’s the opposite.

Cut back to Wheat Ridge, Colorado. Other then the ADL, one local media maven took up a crusade against the car dealer who had had enough. “It’s out of control,” [David] Sirota said. “This conservative hatred of Barack Obama is out of control, and this brings together all those strands of it: the racism, the anti-Muslim fervor. It’s one thing to criticise the president on health care, or Wall Street reform, or immigration. But this is outrageous. And I think it’s a fair question to ask why these questions about religion and ancestry are being directed so viciously at the first African-American President of the United States.”
- - - - - - - - -
Where does one acquire the alien-life-form mental chip that produces this sort of thought process? Whence came this obsession with race or with enforced equality that’s against the very order of the Universe? Not a single right-of-center person I know, or know of, cares whether Obama is black. All would be glad to vote for Thomas Sowell or Walter Williams. The rejection of Obama, his eligibility and his set of ideas is far stronger among blacks like Pastor James Manning, than Phil Wolf’s billboard evinces.

Again, I stare across a chasm at an American Jew, and so do millions who can rarely express it even if they feel it. In case of Sirota, that chip-from-space is imbedded in his resume: stints with U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders, the Al Franken Show, the radical Center for American Progress, the eponymous Progressive States Network, and more.

Sirota’s outlook is not a random occurrence. The Socialist Senator Sanders is Jewish. The “progressive” Senator Al Franken is Jewish. All 13 Jewish U.S. Senators are leftists of various stripes. It appears that of the 31 Jewish members of the U.S. House of Representatives, 30 are leftists.

Sirota’s erstwhile employer, The Center for American Progress, known as the (Jewish patron’s) Soros front has at least two Jews on its five-member executive committee, one of whom, Winnie Stachelberg, maintains a high profile in activities such as “40 Years of LGBT Jewish Activism”.

Judging by the names, half of the Senior Staff are Jewish. In the same way it appears that half of the 20 directors of Sirota’s current passion, the Progressive States Network are Jews.

Reality check: 2% of America’s population is Jewish.

If the ADL, like the SPLC, is an ethnic shakedown operation, it’s disgusting, but the mental chip is more worrisome. Yosi Sargent, the Obamoid whom Glenn Beck made famous, boasted, “I drank the Kool-Aid. I am alive with it, I believe — an Obama saying ‘we are the change we have been waiting for.’

If I looked like this, if my name were Yosi, if I worked for Yitzhak Rabin before working with frenzied zeal for BHO, I would not be surprised if white Christians in a nation founded and made great by white Christians grew to hate me. Let alone if these peoples’ ancestors had given mine a safe and blessed harbor from the persecution and poverty that had been the latter’s lot in Europe

One day, I was driving and listening to the Dennis Miller Show. Miller was asking his Jewish liberal “sidekick” Sal if there was anything that Obama could do that would cause Sal to oppose Obama. Sal said, “No.”

Sal then said, earnestly, that he feared “right wing Christians.” Obama was his shelter. He did not actually recite the 23rd Psalm, but as he spoke I was transposing in my head the immortal lines to modern times:

Barack Hussein Obama is my shepherd, I shall not want;
He makes me lie down in Green captures.
He leads me beside shill paupers.

What a difference a wee 3000 years makes. The Jewish writer(s) of yore had enough wholesome vitality to write the 23rd and other such cornerstones of Western Civilization. But the main output of the modern Jewish intellectual ranges from Rules for Radicals on the left, to A People’s History of the United States on the right.

It bodes ill. The 2008 FBI official hate crimes statistics are out (hat tip Debbie Schlussel,

and 67% of U.S. “religion-inspired” Hate Crimes are against Jews. Schlussel comments further, “More than a few of those anti-Semitic hate crime perpetrators are, in fact, Muslims. Missing from the FBI stats are the stats on the perpetrators of these crimes.”

But there is more to this, as I wrote in May 2009:

Political choices have faces on them too. In March 1994, Rashid Baz, a Lebanese immigrant cab driver in New York, looking for Jews to kill, fired at a van full of Hassidic boys, killing one. In February 1997, Ali Hasan Abu Kamal, a Palestinian immigrant, shot seven people and killed one on top of the Empire State building, because he objected to U.S. support for Israel. In July 2002, Hesham Mohamed Hadayet, an Egyptian immigrant, murdered two people and wounded four at Los Angeles Airport’s El-Al Israeli Airlines terminal. In November 2003, in Paris, Adel Boumedienne, an Algerian “jeune” born in France, cut the throat of his longtime friendly Jewish neighbor Sébastien Selam, gouged his eyes out and boasted, “I killed my Jew.” In January 2006, a gang of 20 mostly African Muslim immigrants led by Youssef Fofana, kidnapped and tortured to death Ilan Halimi, 23, a French-Moroccan Jew, in Paris. In July 2006, Naveed Afzal Haq, a Pakistani-American, shot up the Jewish Federation of Seattle, murdering two and wounding four while screaming, “I am a Muslim American, angry at Israel.” This is just a quick snapshot, and a preview of things to come.

A Jewish politician for the Labour Party in Birmingham just had her own preview. She was denied the opportunity to vie for a ward councilor post because of being “White and Jewish.” But why would there even be a Jewish Labour politician, let alone in a city whose ex-lord mayor, incidentally the one who found her unacceptably Jewish, is a Mahmood Hussain? Such a level of madness cannot be cured through persuasion. The patient can recover only through eating copiously of the bitter fruits of her own derangement.

Those fruits may be quite fruity, for on the other side there are deranged persons too. In my readers’ mail, there is an almost-daily love note like this:

Instead of spreading more Jew Spew nonsense — do yourself, your Tribe, and the rest of genuine Humanity a huge favor, and spend your time editing that vile, twisted evil, racial-hatred stratagems contained in the Talmud. The poisoned source of 99.9% of the misery of Humanity. Every aspect of your Tribe involves invading a Human society, infiltrating, plundering, looting, and obliterating everything every-one else has created. Your Race lives as acidic parasites, and the “blessings” of the Tribe are the gifts of Lucifer.

It’s an unfortunate impediment to Jewish self-introspection and self-correction that such “critique” is usually uttered by psychopathic morons. But it would be a tragedy for Jews to infer, therefore, that all antagonistic feelings toward them are similarly mad and gratuitous.

The more American Jews drink Yosi Sargent’s Kool-Aid, the more hate Jews will attract as a group from the much larger and still favorably predisposed white Christian majority — gradually dispossessed and diminishing though it may be. And the progressives’ Yemeni and Dominican darlings will no more return those warm Jewish feelings than Black America has.

The more Jews seek to defeat traditional America and create an Erewhon of all colors, religions and sexual orientations living in perfect equality in the land of Washington, Franklin, Edison and Truman, the more they will be sawing off the solid branch on which it has been their good fortune to perch for so long.


Previous posts by Takuan Seiyo:

2008 Oct 14 The Real Mark-to-Market
  Dec 1 You Say Mumbai, I Say Bombay
2009 Apr 8 The Deadly Jive of Jiverly Diversity
  Jun 2 The American Press: The Unbearable Lightness of Treason
    12 Critique of the Culture of Kevin MacDonald
  Jul 31 Sons of Onan
  Sep 2 Be the Change

41 comments:

6p00e008d9b78f8834 said...

I am a Jewish convert to traditional Catholicism and I have devised a worthwhile litmus test for true anti-Semitism vs. healthy honesty. The knuckle-draggers combine the liberal-left Jewish radicalism with the Zionist agenda into one incongruous conspiracy. Of course, J Street and the Israeli military are NOT in cohoots.

Fjordman said...

I can understand that Jews fear traditional anti-Semitism in some European countries where this still exists and where there has been a real history of nasty attacks against Jews, but there have been no pogroms in the United States as far as I know. On the contrary, the USA played a major part in defeating the Jew-killing Nazis and has been the staunchest supporter of the Jewish state of Israel throughout its existence. Moreover, millions of Jews have become well-off financially there. So why on Earth do many American Jewish organizations act as if they live in some hellhole where Gentiles kill Jews for sports?

In fact, the only ones who do this nowadays are the Muslims the ADL seems to love. So the ADL is busy supporting the continued immigration of people who kill Jews wherever they can find them and undermine the staunchest friend Jews have had for generations. I know Ashkenazi Jews have the world's highest average IQ, but how smart is this policy really? People who hate Jews generally claim that they only care about their own ethnic group. But apparently, Leftist Jews don't even do that.

The problem with the ADL is that they are censorship bullies who don't just go after the David Duke kind of people, but also alienate common people who just mind their own business. In short, they are creating enemies. That's not a very wise strategy. IF they are so concerned about hate they could take a look at the anti-white messages that have become mainstream in too many Hollywood movies.

Chechar said...

Thanks for this article, Takuan Seiyo! I consider it a sort of postscript to your critique of Kevin MacDonald, which I’ve recently read.

Just before I finally escaped from Spain and a leftist woman who hates Gates of Vienna, I became interested in white nationalism and The Occidental Quarterly. I was extremely dismayed to learn that most of these guys hate the Jews as if we were still living before the Nuremberg trial. Larry Auster wrote about the masthead of my blog: “Cesar covers the bases so skillfully that he even coins a new and needed phrase: ‘non anti-Semitic white nationalism’.”

This said, the incredibly persistent liberal Weltanschauung advanced by the Jews (not the orthodox: the secularized Jews) doesn’t cease to amaze me. It’s difficult to blame the white nationalists for their paranoia as long as these Jews persist with their liberal idiocy.

Yes: I admire Israel as the front line of the West against jihad. But the current situation is so dire that sometimes I harbor the awful thought that a nuclear attack from Iran might be desirable in order that the Jews, who are so intelligent and very influential in our culture, wake up from their bottomless Maya dream… Or mixing metaphors, “There is nothing like imminent pulverization to reprogram a chip in a hurry.” But by then, as you have written in From Meccania to Atlantis about the forthcoming crash, “the velocity will be such that staying or jumping will make no difference.”

Oh my poor Israelis: when will you realize that Khomeini’s speech at Qom demonstrates that fear of death is an inadequate deterrent to the Muslims’ nuclear attack? (Sob, sob…).

A note for GoV-ers:

From Meccania to Atlantis is a must-read book from which I have recently copied and pasted excerpts for my blog: the best intro I know to the subject-matter that concerns us.

However, before reading it I would recommend watching the film that the author chose as the main metaphor, the 1956 movie Invasion of the Body Snatchers. There is a high-quality copy of it that can be watched for free in YouTube, here.

After watching it will be easier to grasp the wit in phrases of the above article such as: “Where does one acquire the alien-life-form mental chip that produces this sort of thought process?” or “In case of Sirota, that chip-from-space is imbedded in his resume.”

Cheers.

César Tort (a.k.a., “Chechar”)

Godffrey said...

@ Fjordman

There has been one pogrom in the history of the United States, committed by the people who have been the greatest beneficiaries of Jewish power: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crown_Heights_riot

Fjordman said...

Godffrey: I did know about that one when I think of it. The fact that it was committed by non-whites is revealing. Yet this hasn't prevented Jewish organizations from continuing to support mass immigration of non-whites. Do they really believe that many of the groups they are importing like Jews? To them, Jews are just whites with more money than the average whitey. There will be more incidents like this one....

Agent Chameleon said...

I am a non anti-Semitic American white nationalist as Lawrence Auster describes, and all these leftist Jews makes my job of showing other white nationalists that Jews are not to blame for our problems very difficult.

It's a vicious cycle, really. Jews will never get involved in any American white nationalist movement due to the current movement's disgusting anti-Semitism, and many American white nationalists will never accept Jews due to the overwhelming involvement of individual suicidal Jews in Left Wing causes.

How to break this cycle? My current strategy is just try to seek out as many non-anti-Semitic white nationalists as possible and form some sort of movement that flat out rejects anti-Semitism, Third Reich nostalgia, and Holocaust denial. Hopefully that will show Jews, who are awakening to the fact that Third World immigration is not in their interests, that it is possible to want to preserve a white American nation and identity, and not have a rapid hatred of Jews or other people.

It's imperative that we white Americans look at what has made the British National Party so successful: a rejection of the Stormfront 1488 Cult and its ideology. Thankfully, BNP intellectual and foreign affairs spokesman Arthur Kemp is writing a book for white Americans on what to do to defend their people, and that includes the first priority of cleaning the house of costumed freaks and hate-mongers. Hopefully this book will have a huge impact.

4Symbols said...

The jewish community in the U.K. should be very concerned about the level of anti-semmetism and anti-Israel politics in the U.K. that is being driven by the islamists and neoliberals.

Look at video footage from most left wing street demos in the U.K. and check out the meaning of the coulors they march under - red, black, white and green - enough said.

Chechar said...

Agent Chameleon,

It seems that there’s already a white nationalist (WN) American movement that includes Jews. If I lived in the States, I would go to their conferences. Speaking with WN Jews is imperative to break this vicious cycle.

My current strategy is different from yours, and more ambitious. While I flatly reject anti-Semitism, today’s anti-white racism is so dire that I can appreciate WN’s Third Reich nostalgia, though at the same time I abhor Holocaust denial. Let me indulge a little in a thought experiment. If I ran the European zoo I’d implement a sort of 4th Reich without a single broken crystal of the Jewish business. Instead, I would canalize the neo-Nazi freaks and Jewry hate-mongers as useful idiots into the proper channels, like unmercifully squashing the white traitors that opened the gates for the immigrants. Eventually we would expel both Muslims and the third-world immigrants from European soil down the Mediterranean south, where they belong.

Nothing immoral as you can see…

Immature, body-snatched pods cannot tolerate dialectic synthesis. They move in comfort zones such as the primitive thesis or its primitive antithesis: neo-Nazism or anti-racialism. The Hegelian verb, Aufheben, translated to English means to sublate: the suppression and assimilation of both, the previous thesis and antithesis. This is the apparently contradictory implication of preserving and changing an ethos. While Hegel used that verb in his philosophy of history, this is my proposed myth: the West, including the U.S., needs to re-Aryanize itself as it was before the fateful 1960s. Mature Aufhebenized people would reject both eliminationist anti-Semitism and at the same time recover an elemental self-esteem for their own ethny.

Only another myth can save us now that the old one is collapsing, and will finally collapse in a few decades. It is an inconceivable tragedy that because of a monstrous hubris the Germans spoiled their golden historical opportunity back in the 1930s to replace the old (Christian and Secular Christian) paradigm with a new one. A hypothetical WN movement could have perfectly worked only as a political religion, with all of its millenarianistic, messianic, Nordic myths and Gnostic aspects of the historical Nazism, but without a shred of anti-Semitism. I for one loved Wagner decades before I became aware of WN. “If I ran the American zoo” I would replace the current Nenderthalesque black rap for Parsifal’s Good Friday. Even Mike Jackson’s music would be forbid. Yes: desperate times require desperate measures. But all of this mental masturbation can only become feasible after The Crash.

It’s not too late for starting to think in terms of a mature Aufheben, even though this goes far beyond the tastes of PC counter-jihadists and the whole pod, body-snatched pathetic culture in which we live.

Agent Chameleon said...

Chechar,

Your thought experiments are interesting, to the say the least. However, a non-anti-Semitic WN movement in America is still lacking. Jared Taylor and his movement is officially "neutral" on the Jewish Question. He accepts both pro-white Jews and neo-Nazis, favoring a big-tent white nationalism, not understanding how moderates and extremists are irreconicable, hence the conflict during the 2006 Amren conference where David Duke hijacked the conference and turned it into a neo-Nazi SA gathering, with many Jewish attendants storming out of the conference in protest. Jared Taylor's reaction was to condemn both sides and tell us that we all need to get along. Jared Taylor is a fool. There is no working with madmen. A mad dog cannot be controlled, and these anti-Semites seem eager to wave their Swastika flag in front of news cameras, and making all defenders of the white race look bad. Considering the outing of Hal Turner as an FBI stooge, I question the true motives of many of these extremists.

Chechar said...

Thanks for the insider info, Agent Chameleon. I missed that meeting. In fact, I have never met a single WN in person in real life. Are they in Mexico? ☺

@ “There is no working with madmen. A mad dog cannot be controlled.”

Actually, if instead of Taylor people like you or I were in charge, we could easily find a Machiavellian compromise. The error I find in PC anti-jihad (Charles Johnson, the most pathological case) is that these people cannot tolerate a anyone even at a centimeter to their right. Instead, I believe that the times are so desperate that we cannot be purists, or have any right-wing enemy to our right.

To put it brutally, Himmler is my friend. To continue my Gedankenexperiment, let’s imagine that I’m running the 4th Reich. Yeap: I would request Herr Heinrich Luitpold’s services. Not as the head person of the SS or my concentration camps, of course, but as an obedient and complying officer in a Slaughter swine house (real Sus dometica swine, I mean). In our campaign to expel the Muslims from Europe we would need swine. Lots of swine. Swine meat everywhere…

The trouble, as I said, is that people like us are not leading the WN movement. If Neanderthals are leading it, it should not surprise us to encounter Neanderthal behavior. But they are not enemies. They’re useful idiots. We only have to make sure that no extermination camp is run by a later-day Himmler. In my thought experiment camps are reserved exclusively for the white bastards who opened the Gates that John III Sobieski had closed.

Disclaimer:

This day-dreaming only reflects the passion of the commenter. It does not represent the position of this blogsite.

Godffrey said...

@ Chechar

Stole the words right out of my mouth. I am of mixed White (Russian and Ukrainian specifically) and Jewish heritage and an avid reader of American Renaissance. I think Jared Taylor's policy on Jews is the right one because to take any strong stance against either side would cause too much infighting. I do not want AR to become a Neo-Nazi publication but I also don't want it to end up like LGF, leading witch hunts against those with a few disagreements at the expense of advancing goals. I think the best option is to keep a respectful distance from the more extreme white nationalists or get them to be useful like you said.

Perhaps you could go to the 2010 AR conference. I would like to hear about the particulars of what they discuss at their conferences.

Takuan Seiyo said...

@Agent Chameleon

We should not be afraid of the label “extremist.” Extremism in the pursuit of truth is no vice. The problem with the crypto-Nazis and WN fellow travelers is not that they are extremist but that they lie, grossly. And that contaminates some truthful parts that they were the first to perceive. Things like the purposeful dispossession and dilution of the demographic base of Whites, campaign against Christianity, hugely disproportionate black violent crime rates, etc.

To take the black crime problem, for example. AmRen provides an invaluable and courageous service in its daily reporting in this regard. But the solution proposed by the “big-tent” cryptos is to ship “the Blacks” back to Africa. And that’s nasty nuttiness that precludes the possibility of mobilizing the majority of Whites relative to the slo-mo pogrom they are being subjected to.

How can people whose ancestors arrived in America in the 19th century talk about “shipping back” people whose ancestors arrived in the 18th century, and involuntarily so? And what gives a hick white ole’ boy from Louisiana the right to talk about shipping back a Marine Corps weapons instructor who also happens to be one of the foremost conservative economists in the world, Thomas Sowell?

What we need, above all, is proper discrimination. And the cryptos' solution of false discrimination is no better than the left’s solution of no discrimination at all.

Takuan Seiyo said...

@ Chechar

I understand and am with you in your frustration. But We need great men like Washington and Churchill, not psycho chicken farmers like Himmler. That we don't have such men at present is another matter. It means that it's a time to build defensive perimeters until we have the right leadership, rather than go on the offensive with the Himmler kind.

bartholomewscross said...

Thank you Takuan Seiyo for another excellent article, and thanks to all the commenters for outlining the various positions/responses to the problem and thanks especially to this blog for allowing views that are at times uncomfortable but always illuminating.

Seiyo is correct: there is a difference between anti-Semitic nutjobs and legitimate frustration with mainstream Jewish political positions. From the one to whom much is given much also is expected. The Jews, God's chosen people, are highly intelligent and highly capable (and no, I'm not a Jew; these are just the facts). Isn't it just one more of the ordinary truths that substantiates the Christian faith? God is just and always fulfills his promises. The Jews are living proof.

But the Jews, as talented and intelligent as they are, are only 2% of the U.S. population, and they are one of the smallest nations of Europe. We might expect much of them, but the anti-Semites expect the impossible. Two do not define 98. The smallest nation does not determine the shape and character of its entire larger civilization. It's ridiculous that the anti-Semites hold two responsible for the self-destruction of 98 and a small nation for the suicide of an entire civilization. We Christians define Christendom (isn't that obvious?) and we shape Western Civilization, not the Jews. And therefore when Christendom falls apart and the West dissolves, it is not the Jews who are responsible but the Christians, either because Christians themselves destroyed and dissolved it or because we failed to stop those who did.

This is really a simple function of numbers.

This does not mean that Jewish traitors, and Christian and secular traitors, should not be brought to account for their actions or that Jews, when acting as Jews, should not be criticized for their actions. But it means that Christians are responsible for expecting Jews to police their own and for holding Jewish advocacy organizations to account when they step over the line. Likewise, Jews ask Christians to police our own and they hold our advocacy organizations to account when we step over the line. This is what healthy coexistence is all about, and as long as both parties are willing to make a go of it (unlike Muslims who are bent on world domination and the extermination of the "kaffir"), it works.

bartholomewscross said...

I would like to make one more comment to any who are reading this who are not explicitly pro-white or are suspicious of those who are. I am a white Christian American, and I like being who I am, and I would like to have descendants who share a common heritage with me and celebrate it without harassment.

I also live in a racially integrated neighborhood, go to an integrated church and am an avid traveler to the countries of various nations. There are problems with full integration (there isn't enough space on this page to go into detail), and I don't particularly like hearing gunshots at night. I'd like them even less if I were ever their target; thank God, I haven't yet been one. But withal I haven't given up on America. I haven't given up on the idea that blacks, reds and whites and, now thanks to the Left, all the other races of man in my country can get along. But I've come to recognize that we must get along on the basis of respect and self-confidence, not subservience. Whites have been made to feel low, degraded, unworthy and contemptible (you wouldn't believe what the average white kid has to put up with at college these days). Not surprisingly, we start acting that way, which invites people to treat us accordingly. Then, when non-whites oblige us, by kicking us down, degrading us, and holding us in contempt, etc., some of us resent it. Some start reading AmRen; others start reading the neo-Nazi barbarians.

Black Americans, Native Americans and others, listen, I want to get along with you. I think we can do it. And if we can finally figure this out, how to respect one another and our boundaries and coexist, imagine what we can do for the world! If we can show that all races of man can live together, trade with one another and do this without the leftist deconstruction of race, sex, nation, culture and religion on the one hand, and without hostility and warfare on the other, imagine the benefit to other nations! That's what it could mean to be an American. Don't you want to be a part of that? I do.

The Leftists' answer for world peace is world homogenization: Since you kids can't play nicely, there will be no playing at all! No! I flatly reject their evil plans and their evil homogenization. The answer of our forefathers, the answer of the Christian faith was not homogenization but sanctification. Christ sanctifies the distinctions that make us unique; he doesn't dissolve them! And in Christ, all of our distinctions regain their God-given functions which harmonize life and coexistence.

bartholomewscross said...

Or maybe the Leftists' position is rather the following:

Since you kids can't play nicely, there will be no more kids at all!

Chechar said...

Ditto Taksei and Bartholomewscross. That’s why I said that the Himmlers can only be useful in swine (or chicken) facilities. The purpose would be that through this strategy the psychos could only channel their rage through the killing of animals. Jews would remain unmolested. As I said: “Not Even A Single Broken Crystal” of their business would be a slogan for my imagined Reich.

This is my 4th and last permitted post in this thread. I find this Aufhebenizing daydreaming so fascinating that, just in case anyone wants to ask me something, please do it in my blog’s entry: Himmler is my friend.

Or just ask it here and I’ll re-post it in my blog along with my reply.

Cheers,

C.

Agent Chameleon said...

Takuan Seiyo,

You raise an interesting point about extremism. And indeed, Chechar, I don't consider neo-Nazis to my right because I don't view them as right-wing. Anyone who favors a totalitarian socialist regime that obsessed over animal rights and deconstruction of cultural values is not right wing in my book. To me, Nazism is a racialized form of Marxism, and has nothing to do with my belief of ethnonationalism, which is the belief of one country for each ethnic group.

I can perfectly understand the fear over resorting to purges due to the persecution you all experienced at the hands of Charles Johnson. I was a Ron Paulian at the time and have no personal experience with LGF, but the whole ordeal was ridiculous. The difference between my proposal, and Charles' zeal, was that Charles labeled as a fascist anyone who felt that Western Civilization was more than just secularism, abortion, evolution, and gay rights. And I'm sure he'd have no love for a self-declared white nationalist like me. ;) My proposal, on the other hand, has to do with actual nutjobs; people who supply Charles and the SPLC with the ammo they need to demonize all defenders of Western Civilization.

I have no interest in standing shoulder to shoulder with "No Jews, Just Right" Alex Linder or Stormfront webmaster Don Black, and the truth is that most other white Americans have no interest in associating with them either. We must look at the British National Party as an example of how to make ethnic nationalism work. The BNP has made great efforts in purging the party of neo-Nazis, Holocaust Deniers, and white supremacists. And guess what, the Party is making advances, and is gaining much support amongst white British. Because the public see the party members and no longer see Hitler-saluting skinhead psychopaths, but normal British men and women concerned about the survival of the British people. People they can relate to. White Americans are among the least anti-Semitic people in the world, and will never tolerate people who shout "No Jews, Just Right".

I strongly encourage readers of Gates of Vienna to listen to these two excellent interviews of BNP officials. I don't particularly care for the radio host, as he's pals with Alex Linder and other losers, but it's great listening to Simon Darby (BNP Deputy Leader) and Arthur Kemp (BNP Foreign Affairs Spokesman) give a sharp rebuke to the radio host for singling out the Jews unfairly. They also have many other great insights.

Arthur Kemp: http://www.radiofreemississippi.net/audio2009/stream.2009-11-27.170229.mp3

Simon Darby:
http://www.radiofreemississippi.net/audio2009/stream.2009-11-18.060211.mp3

Takuan Seiyo said...

@bartholomewscross

It’s time to stop apologizing for being pro-white. America now has an administration that’s explicitly pro-black, and the two most potent organized political forces, ACORN and SEIU, are strongly pro-nonwhite minorities.
The very term “minority” has become an anti-white battering ram. I belong to the minority of the slow-speaking and fast-thinking. The establishment has no interest in Affirmative Action for my kind, even though it would be to the country’s advantage to place others than two-bit used car salesmen in positions of power.

As to your idea that, “All the other races of man in my country can get along” – yes, but only as long as the tolerant Anglo culture retains its primacy and the least racist group – the Whites – is in the majority. Unfortunately, that is no longer a possibility. As per the news today, "White Americans' majority to end by mid-century" ..

If you believe that the nonwhite and largely non-Christian majority in 2085 would accord you, a white Christian man, the same respect and tolerance you are willing to accord them now, you have another thing coming. Eschatological dreams are one thing, but remember that even Jesus’ disciples wore swords...

Conservative Swede said...

No Chehcar, Himmler is not a friend. Not even for minor tasks. He was a traitor to his people like a Mona Sahlin or Josef Stalin, and should be treated accordingly. Nazism represents the biggest crime, by far, against German people -- and by extension all white people. I have summarized my views about it here. But while Nazism was evil, the German people of the '30s were good and decent. Quite as we see in the West today: good and decent people, evil ideology.

UnknownWW2InColor's channel at Youtube shows an abundance of rare amateur films from that time in Germany. Look at this one for example. In spite of the Nazi frame, the goodness, decency and love of life of the German people shines through.

Nevertheless, German people got demonized post-WWII (and by extension all white people). Anti-Nazis and neo-Nazis alike are in complete agreement that Nazism represents European nationalism. They are completely wrong, and everybody seems to be caught in a mental maze here. When faced with a theater like this (as in a Platonic cave) the point is not to jump up on the stage on either side of the game, but to tear down the stage and show how the whole play is false.

Here is the face of the raped German people. This is the final bill the hyper-ideological excesses of the Nazis.

Any reference to numbered German Reiches is a nod to the Third Reich. We can only hope that the Germans will resurge into a nation of confidence. But we can be equally sure that they will not name it as a numbered Reich. However, we can be certain that their enemies will!

So any reference to a future Fourth Reich is immature, confused and counter-productive, and not at all significative of a real friend of the German people (and even if most people do not grasp this, the rehabilitation of the Germans is essential for saving white people in general).

To summarize: So Himmler's neighbour is your friend. But Himmler was a traitor to his people, and certainly not a friend.

I'm aware, Chechar, that you cannot answer here, and will act accordingly.

Chechar said...

“There are no enemies to the right” – A diametrically opposite stance to LGF

@ “No Chechar, Himmler is not a friend. Not even for minor tasks. He was a traitor to his people like…” —Swede

Try to understand my Machiavelian politics. As a writer of hundreds of thousands of words about psychiatric subjects I had to interview schizophrenics. Real schizophrenics. Are they my friends? Not exactly... But I realized they are not the monsters that Hollywood depicts for mass-market consumption. It’s the same with the psychos and even with the murderers (I have talked with them too).

Let’s suppose that Nick Griffin or Geert Wilders reach power. Will they be white knights saving Western civilization. Of course not. The West is so rotten that decent people like Griffins or Wilders are not enough. You yourself stated that what we need are Francos or Pinochets throughout Europe, and that a Germanic revival is pivotal in this hypothetical scenario. Well, Franco or Pinochet + a revival of the Germanic myths = 4th Reich, whether we abhor the 3th Reich or not.

If Griffins or Wilders reach power that could only mean that many more anti-Pods have awaken from the omnipresent Pod culture, and that more Draconian measures will be deemed necessary, including tougher people to squash—Fjordman himself used this verb—the white traitors who created Eurabia. And when tougher people than Griffins or Wilders reach power, to which sort of people will they start asking for help for the actual squashing?

At a personal level, Himmler would never be a real friend. I was merely trying to convey the idea that since Body-snatched Pods are so ubiquitous, as an elemental strategy “There are no enemies to the right”. Even though these traitors to the German people, as you say in your blog, are not exactly right-wingers the practicality of such strategy is so obvious…

Agent Chamelon,

Yes: BNP’s strategy is perfectly OK. In fact, it’s the European party that I most identify with. BNP’s purging from the party the neo-Nazis and Holocaust Deniers is necessary before The Crash.

Nevertheless, once in power you will need a Neanderthal, a Blond Beast to do the dirty work, the actual squashing of the white traitors. (Take note that I am not proposing the killing of immigrants, Muslim or non Muslim, only the legal elimination of our treasonous elites.) And guess who would be profiled for the job? The chicken farmers. They’re my friends!

Baron,

If you like, feel free to remove this 5th post of mine. I could repost it in my blog. And thanks for allowing my above four comments stay in this thread (you could imagine what would have happened to these four posts in LGF!). Cheers, C.

Zeke said...

The Nazi's were as close to pure evil as this world has seen. I will always stand unalterably opposed to any attempt to befriend, rehabilitate, excuse, or justify them.

The presence of neo-Nazi's in any movement drives people away in droves, and rightly so. I can't stand seeing people wearing swastikas. Luckily most of them seem to be serving long terms in state prison where such symbols serve some talismatic purpose.

Himmler is not my friend, and writing such things is just stupid. Just find some other analogy and drop that one. It is horrible. At best it will provide fodder for endless misquotes by people such as SPLC, ADL and others which will be used to discredit this site, and the thoughtful views of the authors and (most of the commentators) here.

I see Baron did post a disclaimer after your comments Chechar. You seem like way to smart a person to continue on with this twisted theme. Were it my sight I'd probably remove your posts on this thread. You've crossed the line.

Baron Bodissey said...

Zeke --

At best it will provide fodder for endless misquotes by people such as SPLC, ADL and others which will be used to discredit this site

Actually, we were "discredited" a long time ago.

I wish I had a nickel for every time that I've been told this or that will "discredit" GoV -- I'd be a rich man.

Allowing people to post their admiration for Nazis will discredit us!

Deleting comments by people who like Nazis will discredit us!

Etc., etc.

I don't sweat being discredited. Fear of being discredited is like fear of being called a "racist" -- once you lose your cherry and get discredited, you realize it's not so bad. And then you are set free.

Worrying about being "discredited" or being called "racists" is part of the Charles Johnson trap. It's the lily-livered lickspittle sniveling candy-ass cowardly way of blogging, and I'll have none of it.

I see Baron did post a disclaimer after your comments Chechar.

Actual, Chechar posted that himself. Smart move.

I assume that our readers are smart enough to realize that our commenters have their own opinions, and that those opinions may well differ from Dymphna's and mine.

But that may sometimes be an unwarranted assumption.

Were it my sight I'd probably remove your posts on this thread. You've crossed the line.

I will continue to apply the posting rules (not the 4-post limit though; that's Dymphna's job) and otherwise let the discussion continue. My tendency will be to err on the side of permissiveness, so as not to break the flow of the conversation.

No matter how much I find their opinions distasteful, people who admire the Nazis (or communists, or Ivan the Terrible, or Genghis Khan) are not breaking the rules. People who call other commenters Nazis, or refer to [insert ethnic group of your choice here] as "scum" or "filth", or advocate exterminating [insert ethnic group of your choice here] are breaking the rules.

Gentlemen, choose your weapons! Let the duel commence.

Dymphna said...

Zeke--

You cross the line when you call another's thinking "stupid". Is it so very hard to refrain from name-calling when you disagree with another's thoughts?

Continue to be 'nice' Zeke. That's a questionable survival skill, as we have sadly learned, but if it works for you, go for it.

And continue to tell us what we should be doing -- or not doing --with our site. It is so much easier than starting up your own site and digging for information and attracting good people who want to help.

Begin with your hatreds...as good a starting place as any, especially if that gives you enough fuel to get down to the hard slog the Baron gets up and does every single day.

None of your suggestions are original. THey've all been said dozens of times before on our comment threads. However, we haven't found them practical or helpful. Perhaps another website would be a better deposit for your ideas since they'll simply be buried here.

If you want to vent about our sins, there's a website around that is dedicated just to "watching" us and commenting on our sins and contemplating our evil existence.

What kind of karma comes with that job, do you think? Imagine, a site devoted to being derivative. Just like Islam. Anyway, look them up and complain. You'll find an eager listener.

So you hate Nazis. Who do you love?

Zeke said...

I've been visiting and commenting on this site for several years. Perhaps not as frequently as others, but it's not like I've never posted here before.

Baron I admire your willingness to host open debate. And I appreciate the work you put into the forum.

I don't believe I advocated all around niceness as the ultimate survival skill anywhere, Dymphna.

So, one can say anything one wants here, excepting using grotesque slurs and calling for violence, including admiration for loathsome characters. Well and good.

But one may not call another posters ideas "stupid"?

I'll have to ponder that for a while.

I have no reason to vent about your sins, because I'm not aware of any. I haven't said anything bad about your site at all, only about Chechar's ideas.

AMDG said...

The tradition of Jewish subversion is very old. As old as the opening of the ghetto.

Nowadays it has become a paranoic attitude, but the tradition is rather old.

BTW, a Simon Rosenberg (not very difficult to guess his etnia...) celebrating the demographic colapse of white Americans:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjROiiTSjLo&feature=player_embedded

4Symbols said...

Takuan Seiyo said...

"but remember that even Jesus’ disciples wore swords..."

Music to my ears.

Takuan Seiyo said...

Re: Nazis, Germans, and our own predicament

As the one in this thread probably most affected by things German and Nazi, I’d like to add my aggregate perspective about recent posts.

First, a caveat: I was born in what had been for hundreds of years German territory, Schlesien, to parents with profound connections to the German culture. Yet they had both lost their entire families to genocide by Germans and – the one a Jew, the other a Slav -- were considered as inferiors according to Nazi ideology.

The destruction of Germany was the fault of the Nazis. The destruction of Europe was the fault of the Germans. In Eastern European languages, when one talks about the horrors of WW2 the word Nazi does not appear at all, only German.

But it would be wrong to infer that the German people are invested with some unique evil. For instance my mother, who could be Cheever’s Sophie with a few modifications, had witnessed the outer limits of depravity committed by Germans in the three concentration camps she had been in and on the streets of her city. Yet, on three mutually unrelated occasions, Germans in uniform saved her life at a risk to their own.

So the question to ask is not how Nazism was possible and what does it mean re: the Germans and Whites in general, but how is it possible that a people with as many virtues as the Germans had, accept the 3rd Reich as the best of all available options and become its accomplice in genocide and the ravaging of Europe. It is widely acknowledged that the answer to that question is the vengeful economic destruction of Germany by the Allies through the Versailles Treaty. [This, BTW, brings thoughts about the USA’s current road to Weimar, and what that will do to our society.]

In the same vein, that we have some neo and crypto-Nazis is less interesting than the question whether there are some legitimate grievances and terrible things being done to us, as Euro-ethnics, Whites, Christians that elicit this pathology. The answer is unequivocally, yes. And what is being done to us, which Gates of Vienna traces incomparably, is far larger and more dangerous than the neo-Nazi pathology. The latter is just a convenient if tiny beacon on which missiles from the current forces of mega-evil can home in, for the destruction of all of us.

So let’s not get exercised about somebody writing “Himmler is my friend.” It’s a wrong choice of metaphor by a youthful and emotionally charged writer, and it’s proper to point that out. But the evil of our age comes not from the Himmler side, but from the other side. And that’s where our vigilance and action should be trained.

As for me, if I had an Alladin’s lamp, one of my three wishes would be to be locked up with Himmler in a bare room, for a mano a mano. But I am not concerned that ADL and SPLC will discredit me, us, and so on because someone mentioned Himmler.

Himmler is dead. In our era, it’s ADL and SPLC that are a part of the enemy tearing me and mine apart. Let’s focus on that.

Abu Abdullah said...

For Takuan Seiyo to note: developments in Japan and Korea.

Zeke said...

Takuan - you've said it far better than I could.

Chechar - It is obvious that you, too, are both a smart and a clever fellow. I would not have criticized you if I didn't value the main points of what you said.

Like you, Takuan, I am of Slavic heritage and lost most of my extended family to the Nazi's. This, no doubt, makes intellectual detachment, a trait so valued on blogs in general and this site in particular, difficult to maintain.

I wonder if people on this thread have seen this site:

http://american3p.com/

It's a thrid party site that seems to be mimicking the BNP for America. I only found it yesterday, and don't have any background on them. But seeing as the BNP was mentioned above, I thought it might interest some.

Takuan Seiyo said...

@AMDG

Subversion is the wrong world. I am not going to pull out the old "A" accusation because I am tired of it, but I’ll appeal to your intellect, to sharpen your thinking.

There are several Jews with a public profile who have expressed sentiments similar to that Rosenberg character, and there are probably many Jews who have been brainwashed by the ADL et al. to believe that a white-minority America will be good for them and good for the ideological idols they worship: peace, justice, tolerance, equality etc.

But in the first place, as the article above attempts to show, such Jews are subverting themselves first and foremost. If you change “subversion” to “self-subversion” you will see that something does not add up in your thinking.

Second, both Bill Clinton and George W. Bush are on record hailing the new, white-minority America, with Bush celebrating the Hispanic angle of that specifically. George Casey, Chief of Staff, U.S. Army, said after the Fort Hood massacre “Our diversity, not only in our Army, but in our country, is a strength. And as horrific as this tragedy was, if our diversity becomes a casualty, I think that's worse.”

That is one of the sickest statements uttered by a white American that I know of, ever in history. And it was made by a WASP wearing a 4-star general’s uniform. How does that square with your thinking?

virtualjudah said...

The Lord promised us as part of the Covenant that we will be a light unto the nations. But there is a consequence to this -- the brightest light casts the darkest shadows. We are a cultural amplifier. We concentrate within ourselves all that is best and all that is worst about every society we live in. Think about this for a second, and you will see that the Lord kept his promise. In spades.

You want to know why our elites are acting this way? It's because they are starkers. Completely barking mad from cognitive dissonance.

Some of you are sane enough to reject the "Jewish conspiracy" nonsense, but you cannot understand what is going on. Even though your civilization and ours have been linked at the hip for two millenia, you have no idea what's going on in our neck of the woods.

You have had the multiculti plague for half a century. We've had it since Napoleon tore down the ghetto walls. You think your elites are bad? Ours are out to exterminate their own people!

Your other problem is that you don't know anything about the true situation in Israel. Have a short primer.

You need to understand what is happening in our civilization for two reasons. One is that you are walking down the same road. We're just up ahead, right on the edge of the cliff, with one foot already up in the air. The other is that when you see weirdos dressed like they just stepped out of a Nativity play shooting it out with the IDF in the name of a Jewish State, you should already have a clue as to whose victory will benefit you. It will keep you from making all kinds of mistakes you will regret later.

We are all in the same boat, you and us and the Indians and the Chinese and everyone else in contact with Islam. Either everyone rows more or less in the same direction or the boat will sink. But you can't do that if you don't have the capacity to see the world through the other guy's eyes.

Takuan Seiyo said...

@virtualjudah

You are committing the same basic cognitive error that the Jew-haters do. You speak per “you don’t know anything,” like they use “the Jews” instead of “Jews” or “some Jews.” But you are posting at a website distinguished in its rare insight into the Islamic peril to the West, as well as being super-friendly to Israel. As to me, I have visited in Israel several times, and have written in published pieces that the Jews (here the “the” is appropriate) are the canary in the coal-mine for Western civilization.

Some of us realize that something has gone grossly wrong in Israel since the 1970s, just like in the United States. It looks like the disease of liberalism, exactly the same disease that’s eating us. To know something about what’s going on Israel, people of our political orientation read Caroline Glick, not Uri Avneri. BTW, I get unsolicited emails from neo-Nazis with references to Gilad Atzmon whom they cite to support their Jews-as-Lucifer creed.

I know an American lawyer who follows Israeli jurisprudence. He says that it’s far more liberal and corrosive to society than the American variant. Hard to believe but must be true. Likewise, the risible Olmert-Livni-Halutz model of warfare in the botched 2nd Lebanon War was a clear precursor to our own ridiculous “Rules of Engagement” against a similarly savage foe.

You are facing the same predicament and future as the Boers and the unwilling Anglos did under de Klerk. Those of us who understand, feel for you.

4Symbols said...

Europeans need their God not a President. The politics of politics will only create division and defeat.

Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s

Rollory said...

This is a marvellously good article and discussion.

I have nothing in particular to add to it.

Conservative Swede said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Conservative Swede said...

Chechar,

There's nothing Machiavellian with achieving in turning your country into a smoking crater, as the Nazis did.

You have got stuck on your meme “There are no enemies to the right”. As if the total reversal of the idiocy of the left holds some wisdom. It doesn't. Quite as there's not anything inherently good in everything un-PC. Much of it is just bad taste and low morality. "Forbidden" doesn't imply good. It never did.

I have no problem in general with friends to my right. But I rather look at what they actually stand for, then celebrating them just for being to the right. You have fallen for the same indirect thinking as the left, where "belonging" is more important than facts. And reckless ideologues -- Nazis, Communists etc. -- have always been traitors to their country, putting their ideology before the interest of the people. Quite the opposite of friends.

Then you continue with comparing Pinochet and Franco with the 3rd Reich. I'm aware that they are put in the same hell as the Nazis by the left, but if you cannot see the difference between Franco and Hitler I fear that there is nothing I could do for you. Look at facts instead of playing the leftist script backwards in your mind! Franco, for the love of his people, avoided being involved in the war. His behaviour was the exact opposite of Hitler's. But to you and the left they are the same...

The second part of your equation above is that any Germanic revival will equal the Fourth Reich. Well as I said above, only the enemies of German people will refer to it as that. So you have put yourself in that box.

My general point since some years ago has been that it's the fear among white people of "becoming like Nazis" that holds us back, and passively let this ongoing fatal and very obvious destruction happen to our civilization. It's not until this fear -- and the narrative fueling it -- is overcome, that a white revival can happen. With your persistent babbling about a "Fourth Reich" you are only helping in cementing and perpetuating these paralyzing myths. By accepting their premises, you are helping the priests in the Platonic cave in enacting their shadow play. My purpose is the opposite one: to kick down the stage and end the theater, and thereby waking people up from their suicidal fears.

Finally, reading your 6th comment (which is not here but at your blog), it becomes clearer that you are driven by: i) animated emotions with regards saying things forbidden/taboo, and ii) a fondness of brutality as such. But there's nothing Machiavellian with indiscriminate brutality. A Machiavellian approach is to see things clearly and to act appropriately and wisely. Brutality should be used with discrimination. Indiscriminate brutality will make you end up as a smoking crater.

Instead of indiscriminately embracing "friends on the right" you should cultivate a love of German people (so far you haven't mentioned them with even a word). If one day you will manage to achieve that, you will realize how very counter-productive your current ranting is.

Conservative Swede said...

Part of Chechar's defense will surely (as always) be that he means his ranting about a "Fourth Reich" as a joke. But then his missing the rhetoric effect of what he's achieving.

Cicero taught us what I call the rhetoric two-step. An example of this:

"Many people claim that Mr. Smith is a pedophile. But I would of course never myself believe in such rumours."

The rhetoric two-step makes it possible for you to: 1) effectively gluing the idea of something nasty (pedophile, Nazi) to someone (and the more horrible, the better it glues), while 2) clearing yourself of any charge of having said so.

Another example:
"A German (or white) revival will lead to a new Nazi empire -- Oh, I was only kidding. Don't you have a sense of humour, dork!

The rhetoric two-step works as if painting twice with a brush; once with paint on the brush, and another without any paint. But it's the stroke with paint on that sticks to the wall. The achievement of associating "pedophile" or "Nazi" to someone is already done.

Takuan Seiyo in his comment above engages in another milder form of two-step when commenting on Nazi-Germany. Every second sentence suggests that German people are not evil, while every other sentence hints that they are.

For example:
The destruction of Germany was the fault of the Nazis. The destruction of Europe was the fault of the Germans.

It's unclear to me what the message is here. If there is at all a message, or just two-step.

Takuan continues:
In Eastern European languages, when one talks about the horrors of WW2 the word Nazi does not appear at all, only German.

Not in Romanian, and I'd guess not in Hungarian. It seems that you are generalizing to far. And nevertheless the same pattern is found in Western Europe. Different for different countries, depending on the degree of trauma and on the nations historical narrative vis-a-vis Germany.

The same for Stalin's troops. In most of Eastern Europe they were/are referred to as "Russians" rather then "Communists". However, in neither case it conveys any truth about the character of Russians or Germans.

but how is it possible that a people with as many virtues as the Germans had, accept the 3rd Reich as the best of all available options and become its accomplice in genocide and the ravaging of Europe.

How was Stalin possible in Russia? How is the EU possible today? Etc, etc. It's the same question, and the same answer. It seems that ideological horrors and brutal crimes can happen anywhere among any people (Cambodia, Zimbabwe, etc.). Political repression works with massive effectiveness, and among any people there are always enough willing henchmen to keep it up. This is a legacy of mankind, not of Germans or white people.

Chechar said...

Swede,

It surprises me that you taught me the phrase “full-throttle hate” when dealing with the enemy after we get more powerful, and yet you write now in the tone of PC counter-jihadists. Yes: Spencer and Wilders are doing the right (Machiavellian) thing, using PC temperate language. But we are just bloggers and we’re not supposed to comply with the PC rules in the blogsphere.

The equation is not totally mine. It was Tom Szasz who said that fascism + eliminationist anti-Semitism = Nazism. Or to define it in negative terms: Nazism - eliminationist anti-Semitism = the Francos or Pinochets you talk about. I think that’s a good definition in spite of the fact that the immense hubris of the Nazis left Germany as a huge crater that is swallowing the entire West.

I believe that you have accepted the false dichotomy popular after World War II that the German people and the Nazis are totally distinct and separate entities. What stuck me the most in Daniel Goldhagen’s Hitler’s Willing Executioners is that most Germans didn’t complain about the night of the broken crystals and, more shockingly, that no outrage was expressed by any public figure in Germany, even though many Germans had complained when the Nazis advanced the euthanasia program for retarded Germans and when they withdrew the crucifixes from the schools. And very few Germans complained when, after Kristalnatch, the Jews were sent to the ghettos (this, again, before WW2 broke out).

Despite the many criticism by the PC academics, I think that Goldhagen’s thesis stands: most adult Germans were infected with a malicious sort of anti-Semitism that, in the hands of the Nazis, ended up as the Holocaust.

“…no enemy to my right”

What is your problem with this, man? Have you read what Taksei said about GoV-ers?: On the one hand the UN, the EU, Obama and the media and the academia and the millions of Pods and the traitors and the feminists and Hollywood (yesterday I watched the treasonous Avatar)… On the other hand Zenster tries to balance all that! “To paraphrase again that great teacher, Stalin, ‘Zenster? How many divisions has he got?’”

Come on, we need a few friends, buddy! (or provisional “allies” if you like). We are so few that it’s high time to make a pact with the Devil himself. Nobody has said a peep about my Aufheben statement, let alone about my pragmatism that, when the “Francos or Pinochets” you talk about reach power, someone will have to do the dirty work.

Take that incendiary post you mention (the one which only appears in my blog) as a legitimate, anti-Pod reaction to that nasty little paradigm of Podism: Johnson.

P.S.

In your second post you mention Stalin. This reminds me something. After reading The Gulag Archipelago I realized that the sociological causes of the Gulag were far more disturbing than what I previously thought. What Goldhagen said about the Germans I could say about the Russians and Stalin’s willing executioners.

Conservative Swede said...

Chechar,

OK, so I speak PC language according to you. That shows how way far off from reality that you are in your mind.

You haven't payed attention to anything I have said. Everything you write in your last comment has already been covered by me above. Such as: Use brutality with discrimination. Do not apply the principle of "friends to the right" indiscriminately. But you refuse to get the idea of discrimination. Every principle has to be applied indiscriminately for you. Everything has to be completely black or white. And if it's not completely black, it's PC talk.

We certainly don't need you and your Fourth Reich. We don't need your master race. That's the idea that fueled the indiscriminate warfare, as well as the genocides, and thereby the ruin of the country. Instead we should just love our own people, and put their interests first. The concept of "master race" was an ideological construct, and behind it was disregard and even despise of the German people. Yourself, you are just interested in the perverted symbolism and brutality of Nazi-Germany. Not a single word of love for the German people. Instead you describe Germans as uniquely evil, "infected with a malicious sort of anti-Semitism".

According to you, Franco and Pinochet is the same as Nazism except for the antisemitism. But neither are there master race, reckless warfare, obsessive racial purity, ideological hubris, etc. In fact, there is not even fascism with Franco and Pinochet. So the only thing that is left of the equality that you set up is the leftist lie that all right-wing nationalism is the same as Nazism and Hitler. And you have bought this lie hook, line and sinker.

Both Franco and Pinochet were the opposite of ideology. And they saved their people from dangerous ideological excesses (the opposite of what the Nazis did!). They used violence with discrimination, with the net result of saving their people from vastly more violence and destruction. But yes, they are still part of the leftist script saying "All European nationalism = Nazism". And they way you speak of Franco and Pinochet shows, among other things, that you have fully internalized this myth, and intend to cement and perpetuate it.

You interpret what I write just as twisted as a leftist/liberal -- through the some sort of splatter movie images -- but for some sick reason you get turned on by it. I'm disgusted by your interpretations of what I have written, and I'd be grateful if you'd stay away from referring to my ideas again, since you never understood them in the first place, and only defame them with your sick and twisted interpretations.

Chechar said...

Sick? As I said, nobody said anything about my Aufheben statement, which both suppresses the evils of the German anti-Semitism of the 1930s and at the same time recovers the pride for one’s own ethny.

I see that this is getting personal. And we have hijacked a thread about Taksei’s article. I for my part will stop discussing at this point but I must thank both Taksei and Zeke for their critical comments about what I wrote (Godffrey on the other hand liked it).

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A final comment unrelated to the above post

My second and third books of my series of five contain several chapters highly critical of Nazism. The “Aufheben” thinking about World War II only came to my mind when I learned about how the West has been doing everything in reverse after the world wars: a suicidal train that is speeding up towards the precipice and that will crash during our lifespan. That changed my mind a few months ago. Now I believe there’s something redeemable in, say, the European nationalisms before the First World War.

About a year ago I still was a liberal who believed somehow in feminism, the Democratic Party, the European Union, Hollywood, the media and more. I even had brown girlfriends here in Mexico. I surprised myself by revaluating so drastically in my mind the old-fashioned nationalisms and pride for our ethnic group. This does not mean that today I reject the extremely critical chapters I wrote about Nazism. It’s only that, after I have seen the liberal monster to the eyes, I realized, as Taksei stated above, “that the evil of our age comes not from the Himmler side, but from the other side. And that’s where our vigilance and action should be trained”.

When the next chapters of my Quetzal book appear you all guys and gals will see how history, real history, is the perfect debunking of the myth of the noble savage, as it is being discussed in another GoV thread about the most recent Hollywood scandal.

See you there!

Chechar.