So she sent us her story, and I offered to post it.
I am in a quandary.
Living in outer suburban Melbourne, we have a lot of different cultures/belief systems/ethnicities in the area.
Generally, this is neither here nor there to me — as far as I’m concerned, I don’t care if you’re black, white or brindle. Just leave me to live my life in peace, and I’m fine.
Of course, life doesn’t always work out so smoothly, and I’m finding it annoying to find a decent place for Miss Junior to learn to swim.
Where we used to live, in downtown outer Melbourne, there was a good gym with a pool, and she had lessons there. It catered for a varied clientele, with a completely segregated women’s section for those who were obliged to work out away from men, and a pool with the change rooms right at the poolside as most swimming pools.
I trained in the women’s section mainly because I couldn’t be fussed walking down the hall to the mixed section, and often swam laps while Miss Junior had her lessons.
This new pool she’s going to a couple of suburbs away is a bit bigger with two changing rooms for each sex.
The smaller rooms are considered family rooms, and there are often young boys getting changed when we are in there.
When I say young, I mean under 10.
There must be something wrong with me, because I find that really inappropriate.
As a result, we started using the larger change rooms, and the first time we were there, I turned around to see a lad of at least 10-12 walking by.
- - - - - - - - -
Miss Junior was in an open shower, although I had ensured that she wasn’t in view of passersby, but that’s not the point.
WTF are pubescent boys doing in the women’s changing rooms?
I had a talk with one of the counter staff there, and asked him what were the guidelines for children getting changed.
In the family changeroom (the smaller), it is up to the discretion of the family, so up to around 12.
In the larger changeroom, then you’d be looking at no older than 6.
I did very well at not going off my tree.
First of all, as I explained to the fellow, my daughter is nearly 6 years old and I’m trying to teach her modesty. That means not getting her kit off in front of strange boys.
I don’t appreciate boys who are half a foot taller than her getting changed in front of her, or her getting changed in front of them.
What sort of message does that send her about politeness and dressing appropriately.
I also don’t appreciate young boys trying to peek under the toilet door, and I don’t see why I should feel obliged to shut my girl in a shower cubicle so that she can wash down and dress without the possibility of boys seeing her naked.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m a long way from being a prude, but this is ridiculous!
I’ve not even started on my discomfort at changing where young boys are within view.
It’s one thing for their mother to get into and out of her swimwear in their presence, but sorry, I’m over 40 years old, and while I’m not ashamed of my body, I’m damned if I’m getting buck naked in front of unfamiliar males of any age.
Hell, I don’t even get naked in front of familiar males any more!
The staff member was a bit taken aback with my concerns, and offered to get the duty manager to talk to me, but as I told him, what would that fix? Nothing. Just be aware that some of us women don’t like lads being in reach of either us or our girls’ bodies.
Another concern, which I did not voice, is that there are also patrons of cultures that prefer that women not be uncovered.
There have been women in hijab in the changeroom with their sons while my daughter was changing, and I wonder uncomfortably at the message these children are getting.
I’m well aware that under Islam, good women stay covered while the bad ones let it all hang out.
Does this mean that my young daughter will be seen by these young boys as bad because she took off her clothes to put on a swimsuit in their presence?
Catmeat Sheikh Hilaly has a lot of supporters, some here in Melbourne, so why not some who come to our pool?
I don’t swim anymore while Miss Junior is having her lessons, and I’m looking around for another swim school.
I don’t dare raise my concerns to the staff because of our discrimination laws, and the very real possibility of someone saying something to another person and suddenly there’s an outbreak of offendedness.
Needless to say, I’m very, very angry about this, but what can be done to combat it?
I personally get uncomfortable at swimming laps in front of people I know see me as inferior and unclean. While it begs the question of why they go to the pool in the first place, I also get offended at the fact that if I were to express my discomfort, then I would be labelled racist, bigoted, Islamophobia and all the rest.
If anyone else is upset, then it’s my fault for being white and upsetting them.
If I am upset, then it is my fault for being white and not sucking it up.
I know I’m not the only one, but others are also a bit too timid to speak out.
— Angie
16 comments:
While it begs the question of why they go to the pool in the first place
Why? To express their dominance over you. I doubt such facilities would exist (for women) in a Muslim state.
If and until we can get reasonable decency rules back into effect in the West, we are done. And that means decent behavior in effect for ALL. Muslims included. Our rules not theirs. Decent behavior means not being offended just because you can like all the Muslims seems to repeatedly do. Oz has got to have all the 'hate speech' laws repealed. We have to make it plain we are Christian nations and not be ashamed of it.
"Generally, this is neither here nor there to me — as far as I’m concerned, I don’t care if you’re black, white or brindle. Just leave me to live my life in peace, and I’m fine."
I appreciate what this writer has to say. Her experiences are what we are all running into in one form or another no matter whether it is in Australia, The US or Europe. Her last sentence above however is IMO the key. While there are certainly exceptions the bottom line is they will NEVER leave you to live your life in peace. They will NEVER allow freedom of association, freedom to educate your children as you see fit and never allow you to forget you are white and responsible for the evils of the world by being so. The only way we can reach their idea of Nirvana is complete destruction of strong whites and Western culture. The socialist, multiculturalist, Utopian builders etc will continue down this path to force you/us to comply until we either all become Borg or until we stand up and say no. There will be ultimately no nice way to do any of this.That is unless you think they will give up or give in.
I think one of the most brilliant politicians ever, Thomas Jefferson, had said: "All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent".
I agree with Ernest. We need to take a stand. Some innocent/patriotic people may be harmed by lawsuits and/or jail especially like in my home country of Canada by the PC/thought police. Please read more about it here. We need to think about our children's future, because this is only going to get worse.
The longer our massive influx of unassimilating immigrants continues to pour in; and the longer we remain silent, the harder it will be to correct in the future. If you want to come to my country, fine... but you will change when you come here. Not us. BTW, we need to figure out a way to get rid of orgainizations like the farcical CHRC.
Very true, Ernest. Most people would be satisfied to just be left alone to live in peace, but unfortunately Islam won't leave us alone, whether we leave them alone or not.
Honestly, that sounds like the kind of reasoned, well-thought out letter that a reasonable person would mail to an influential newspaper (or 3) - perhaps edited a little for redundancy, but it looks really good to me. The concerns expressed are anything but exaggerated.
I'm not as familiar with Australian papers, but I've read articles online from "The Australian" and others - seemed fairly conservative. Or could you actually get charged in court for a letter to the editor?
This story doesn't make sense to me. I think it's made up.
I'm an Aussie, in the inner northern suburbs of Melbourne. Admittedly haven't been to the pools for a long time as generally don't like public pools.
But, this story does not add up. It's too vague, too bizarre. I'd like more details of where this is in Melbourne. I can check it out.
Chrissie
randian: To express their dominance over you. I doubt such facilities would exist (for women) in a Muslim state.
Years ago, before I finally had disabused myself of the notion that "moderate" Muslims exist, people would counter my calls for blanket application of restrictions upon Islam by citing how it was "not monolithic".
Presuming that it is not, how does one go about explaining away the fact that the behavior described by Angie seems to be nearly universal wherever male Muslims immigrants are to be found?
Turkish, Moroccan, Saudi, Iranian ... you name it, all of them seem to engage in this not-so-subtle campaign of intimidation, especially against Western (read: white) women.
It reminds me very little of Pat Condell's questions for the "unprincipled, vote-whoring, cultural apologists", otherwise known as EU bureaucrats:
What I'd like to know from our European politicians, if they can spare a couple of seconds to step down off the gravy train is: When will it be time to stop showing respect for Islam?
Will it be when they take away your wine and your beer because they disapprove of it? Would that do it for you? Or perhaps when your wife is beaten up for showing her face in public.
Or maybe you'll wait until your daughter is raped and then punished for it. Would you show less respect then or continue to be culturally sensitive and suck it up, like you're sucking it up now?
Harsh as it may sound, us rabble probably will need to find a way that ensures the women and children of these "unprincipled, vote-whoring, cultural apologists" get exposed to this very same treatment.
While I refuse to advocate Brusselsesque train station rapes, or skull-crushing beatdowns by youth gangs armed with metal bars, as any sort of proper treatment for such elitist hothouse flowers, it's difficult to imagine what else might get the undivided attention of these "unprincipled, vote-whoring, cultural apologists".
Until the elite begin feeling our pain at similar—if not much greater—levels, don't expect them to do anything until they find their necks stretched out on Islam's chopping block. Cold consolation that would be as, by then, it already would be too late for us wee folk.
Which, again, is why I speculate about the eventual necessity of making sure women and children of these "unprincipled, vote-whoring, cultural apologists" get a taste of the Multicultural medicine they're so busy ramming up our ... er, down our throats.
Natalie: ... unfortunately Islam won't leave us alone, whether we leave them alone or not.
I predict that Islam will require substantial amounts of negative attention before they—at least however many it is that actually survive those attentions—finally decide that they're better off leaving us alone.
"Most people would be satisfied to just be left alone to live in peace"
Don't try to fight the nature, guys: as long as there are live creatures on Earth, they will have their ambitions, and conflicts as a consequence of clashing ambitions.
Peace is temporary, and it must be earned from time to time (like in numerous conflicts such as WW1, WW2).
There is neither reliable vaccine for "being peaceful" - since mentality must be changed in order to achieve that. And changing mentality takes numerous generations. Much, much longer than some of the countries are existing.
Bo , If you have not been to a public pool in a while and do not know the current situation ..Keep your trap shut and do not call the lady a liar .
Look people, we all have a job to do. This is our culture and no matter how many mandarins say otherwise these new people must be schooled to it. Unless there is a serious chance of physical violence we must all step up to schooling these uneducated immigrants. This means speaking up loudly when they transgress YOUR norms, getting angry, being rude, throwing a hissy fit, insisting they are perverts before they have a chance to say anthing to you.
Perhaps start with a "peeping tom" complaint, in the police station, against the lad looking under the doors.
As for swimming, I not only swim whenever I damn well please if one of those little spindly Asian people gets in front of me who can't keep pace I ask them to go the beginner section until they have sufficient speed and technique as the rest of us old white guy master swimmers.
In other words "f*ck off", this is MY pool, MY country, MY standards and you are, at the very least going to know exactly where *I* think you stack up.
I've seen black Muslim men looking at my daughter, and believe you me, I'd be getting my freaky on if anything inappropriate was being said to her. I'm sure they can tell by the looks I give, that they would be doing battle with me. Quit caring what others think - stand up for yourself.
I would have yelled at the young man for being in the girl's changing room and told him to get out. I've never heard of boys 10 to 12 years of age being allowed to change with girls - this is really bizarre.
The anonymous lady doth protest too much. I smell a rat here - is she a mohammedame herself?
I don't know if it's my lack of English skills or what. But I feel that this lady has a serious issue, but not the way it's presented here.
As I understand, she is complaining over a 10-12 year old boy being in the same dressing room as herself? A 10-12 year old!
May you not ever come to Sweden in that case. I was changing clothes with girls until I was 18. And there are many public places here with mixed saunas.
Shees- get a life...
As a matter of fact. No one here in Sweden has ever been raped in a public sauna. If you don't want to show your body to strangers- or even relatives- it's you that have a problem.
Being nude is not a problem until you make one out of it!
By all means, cover yourself up if you feel the need (might I suggest a burqini), but be realistic otherwise.
Pela68, there's a difference between choosing to go to a co-ed sauna, and having your privacy violated in a changing room. 10-12 year old boys have sexual curiousity, and women and girls who use a changing room aren't obligated to put on a strip show for them. I've been to lots of co-ed saunas and nude beaches (when I was younger and in better shape, of course), and that was fun, and everyone was well-behaved, but it's quite annoying to have some little creep spying on you if you want privacy.
latté island, you've got a point there. I stopped going to a local nude beach in the middle of town a few years ago, when the increasing incidence of mohammedim male migrant adolescents became a public nuisance.
These young pests - the third world cousins of Beavis and Butthead - would cruise the nude sections (just by chance, mind you!), snickering and leering the whole time.
The best solution would have been a court order demanding their presence at the same beach, together with that of their sisters and mums (all in the nude, understood) for a couple of days, to demonstrate their good will.
Alas, I found no imam to back me.
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